McCain a hit at Pueblo town hall meeting
By Todd Hartman, Rocky Mountain News , Julie Poppen, Rocky Mountain News (Contact), Ed Sealover, Rocky Mountain News
Published October 3, 2008 at 8:48 a.m.
Updated October 3, 2008 at 1:35 p.m.
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Photo by Judy DeHaas © The Rocky
People start filling the bleachers inside the Massari Arena on the CSU-Pueblo campus before John McCain's town hall meeting Friday, October 3, 2008, in Pueblo.
Photo by Joe Mahoney © The Rocky
Republican presidential candidate Sen, John McCain, of Arizona, listens to an audience member's question at a campaign stop in downtown Denver on Thursday afternoon, Oct. 2, 2008.
PUEBLO — Republican presidential nominee John McCain is speaking in Pueblo today. The Rocky's Julie Poppen, Ed Sealover and Todd Hartman are blogging live.
12:09 p.m.
The third question is from a high-school student who asks what McCain can do to improve American education.
On the overall issue of education, McCain says, choice and competition are needed in kindergarten through 12th grade.
"What is the value of access to a failed school? There is none . . . Charter schools work. Home-schooling works if parents want to do that," he says.
McCain notes there are more than 30 charter schools in New Orleans now and that there is an increase in the quality of education there because of that.
He adds that he'd like to delay college graduates' requirements to pay off debt. And he wants to make sure that student loans are available.
Question four comes from a man wearing a "Democrats for McCain/Palin" shirt. He asks McCain to clean house and "expose those people who have taken us to the cleaners" in Congress.
A smiling McCain responds: "I want to promise you that this is what it's all about: Restoring trust and confidence in government," especially with polls showing Congress' approval ratings sitting around 15 percent.
McCain turns to Republican U.S. Senate nominee Bob Schaffer, a former congressman from Fort Collins, and thanks him for running. Schaffer is battling Democratic Congressman Mark Udall of Eldorado Springs for the open seat now held by retiring U.S. Sen. Wayne Allard. The race is one of the most closely watched in America.
Then, at 12:09 p.m., McCain thanks the crowd and ends the town hall.
12:04 p.m.
The first question to McCain comes from a Vietnam veteran and American Legion member concerned with post-traumatic stress disorder, a condition that he says afflicts a good friend of his. He asks McCain's policy on PTSD.
McCain acknowledges the strain on soldiers who are patrolling constantly and living with the people they are in Iraq to defend. His first priority is to care for veterans who are showing a dramatic rise in PTSD and combat-related wounds, he said.
America must increase the capabilities of military medicine and the Department of Veterans Affairs to treat PTSD, he said. But it also must give veterans a card to allow them to seek civilian health care and bill the government so that they don't have to wait in line for care, he said.
The second question is from an Air Force veteran who supports him and says that he can't imagine what McCain went through while being held for five years as a prisoner of war in Vietnam. His question is about the financial rescue plan, specifically about whether McCain supports rolling back interest rates and principal on their homes to help keep people in their homes.
McCain responds that Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae started the housing crisis by getting people to take mortgages that they could not afford. Now, we have to stop the continuing decline in home values, McCain said.
We can do this by allowing any homeowner to go to the Federal Housing Administration to get 30-year fixed-rate mortgages, he said. And we need to create more oversight of the housing and loan market, he said.
"I'm not interested in helping Wall Street in any way," he said. "But the innocent bystander, the homeowner, those have to be shored up."
11:52 a.m.
A number of veterans are on hand at CSU-Pueblo to attend the town hall. McCain recognizes them before telling the crowd: "I will bring our troops home from Iraq, but I would like to bring them home with victory and honor."
This produces the second "USA! USA!" chant of the morning.
In August 2007, a woman stood up at a town-hall meeting and asked McCain to wear a bracelet with her son's name on it and made him promise that he would do everything in his power to make sure her son's death was not in vain, he said. He thinks of her every day of the campaign.
After getting the crowd excited, McCain exhorts the crowd to get out and work for him over the next 32 days. "I am the underdog," he says before opening up for crowd questions.
11:48 p.m.
On the bailout bill, McCain emphasizes that he is a "proud pork barrel opponent" but feels something must be done to step in and fix the economy now.
A jobs report that came out today painted a "terrible" picture for America, he noted.
Part of that economic recovery involves eliminating America's dependence on foreign oil, McCain tells the roughly 3,500 people in the arena. And a big part of doing that is through clean coal, he said.
Colorado is home to nine coal mines.
Drilling offshore also will be key to the country's energy policy, McCain said - as well as wind and solar energy and the production of more flex-fuel cars. But he spends the most time on nuclear power, which he calls "clean" and "green."
Other countries, such as France and Great Britain, can reprocess spent nuclear fuel, so Americans can too, rather than worrying about where to store all of it, McCain insists.
After discussing these hot-button issues, McCain returns to familiar Republican theme: Cutting the size of government and instituting tax relief.
One of those tax breaks is the $5,000 refundable health-care tax credit that became an issue in the vice-presidential debate last night. McCain calls it a way for families to afford health care, while Biden referred to it in the debate as a tax burden because the credits will be taxable.
11:42 a.m.
McCain leads into his talk by noting the performance of his running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, in last night's debate with Democratic vice-presidential nominee Joe Biden. "Viva la barricuda," McCain said of the woman who was nicknamed "Sarah Barricuda" when she led her high-school basketball team to a state championship.
The Arizona senator says he "almost felt a little sorry for my friend Joe Biden last night" because of the message that Palin presented in the debate.
"I'm so proud of her performance last night, but I'm more proud that she has been such a role model and inspiration to millions and millions and millions of Americans," McCain said. "It's a team of two mavericks."
The Republican nominee segued from there into prepping the crowd for Tuesday night's nationally televised debate between himself and Democratic nominee Barack Obama, calling him "the most liberal member of the United States Senate."
He then quickly looks to quell the biggest controversy he has stirred up in Pueblo.
"I want to say on behalf of all my fellow citizens: 'Thank you for the water. We appreciate it.'" He then says that he will "never, ever seek a renegotiation of the Colorado River Compact," which is different than a statement he made to the Pueblo Chieftain earlier this year.
11:34 a.m.
Pueblo City Councilwoman Vera Ortegon introduces McCain as a veteran, an abortion opponent and a tax cutter.
Before she does, the crowd breaks out into the "USA! USA!" chants that commonly mark a McCain rally.
"It is cliche, but it is really true. This is going to be a critical campaign and a critical election," Ortegon said.
She notes that Hispanics believe in the importance of national security, one reason that Hispanics are so well represented in the military. And McCain, a decorated Navy hero from the Vietnam war, "knows how to keep this country free."
"He will keep us safe from the Taliban or from Al Qaeda or from whatever group comes to disrupt us," she said.
Ortegon noted also that Hispanics are very religious people who believe life begins at conception - a belief shared by McCain.
11:38 a.m.
A full crowd has packed into the Massari Arena at Colorado State University-Pueblo to hear McCain speak.
He is introduced by Pueblo City Councilwoman Vera Ortegon and comes in to the tunes of Kenny Loggins' Highway to the Danger Zone, shaking hands as he makes his way through the crowd.
11:03 a.m.
McCain disembarks from his plane and greets a small group of well-wishers. He jumps in his limo, part of a 13-vehicle caravan, and heads for the town hall meeting.
10:50 a.m.
John McCain’s plane lands at the Pueblo airport.
10:49 a.m.
Chuck Wilcox stands out of this flag- and McCain-Palin sign waving crowd inside the arena with his bright red sport coat and yellowed Styrofoam hat covered in aging political pins including a Reagan/Bush pin from 1984. He wears a GOP silk neck tie and a pin on his lapel stating "I'm the NRA and I vote."
The 77-year-old retired teacher and businessman, has been active in Republican Party politics for 40 years. He's excited about McCain's prospects.
"Now we have a good team," Wilcox said. "He will really stand up for veterans and defend our country. McCain is so much stronger than Obama. He picked a good VP. That shows his good judgment."
Wilcox, of Canon City, said the rugged individualism that marks his home town is similar to Wasilla, Alaska, where Palin served as mayor.
"We are a little independent," Wilcox joked.
10:47 a.m.
CSU-Pueblo President Joseph Garcia welcomes crowd to fastest growing university in Colorado. Big cheers erupt from the crowd. The excitement is building. Republican Senate candidate Bob Schaffer takes the podium.
"This an exciting welcome to true American hero," Schaffer says.
Crowd goes wild - again.
"It's time for us to be making that choice about what direction our country will go. This is a state that played a crucial role in electing the last two presidents of the United States. What this country needs to hear from Colorado is an expression of our western values - rugged individualism."
Points out "we will give up everything for freedom." Big applause.
People stomping their feet when he describes McCain as the next president.
McCain will veto every spending bill that has an earmark in it, Schaffer says.
10:40 a.m.
Rally has now started. People are saying the Pledge of Allegiance. Now they're cheering and waving flags. Women are singing the National Anthem. People are standing up with hands on their hearts.
10:23 a.m.
James Santilli's five Republican friends are working him over -- hard. They've dragged the self-described independent to McCain's town hall meeting with the hope he'll complete a convoluted cycle. Santilli started out supporting Obama, switched to Ron Paul and is now considering McCain.
The Colorado State University at Pueblo students said some of their classes were canceled, allowing them to attend the high profile event in a battleground state.
As for Santilli, a 20-year-old computer information systems major and Canon City native, he remains torn.
He's not entirely buying his friends' arguments for McCain. When asked why he was here, he planted his tongue firmly in his boyish cheek: "To get some straight talk from the maverick."
He's very concerned about the economy and his job prospects upon graduation.
"I'd like to ask him about his plan to take on the debt?"
John Lamberson, 23, Santilli's friend, active member of the College Republicans and organizer of this political expedition, hasn't given up hope for his buddy.
"I've been working on him for the last month."
Lamberson, who is also celebrating his birthday today, himself acknowledged disappointment in Congress -- even under Republican leadership. But the English major said he still fundamentally backs Republican ideals when it comes to national security, the economy and foreign affairs. He thinks Washington needs change.
"Instead of getting anything done for the people, they'd rather turn it into this game and insult President Bush."
10:15 a.m.
The crowd is buzzing inside the Massari Arena. Large "Straight Talk * Town Hall" signs are installed in the stadium seating. McCain/Palin signs adorn the stairs heading into the rafters. A band is playing. The crowd is animated and clearly excited. Huge American and Colorado flags adorn one wall of the arena. Flag print cloth is draped on a long table where some food servers sit. A couple police officers stand on a balcony scanning the crowd. Feels a little like a convention.
10:06 a.m.
Anthony Pace, 30, is making bank in Colorado with his array of McCain/Palin paraphernalia. The fatigue print McCain cap is especially a hot seller. Pace, who calls Philadelphia and New York City home, was outside McCain's town hall meeting in Pueblo today hawking his wares with his business partner. His team of political swag sellers has traversed 40 states -- so far this week he's been in Milwaukee, St. Louis, Denver and Reno. But nothing compares to Colorado.
Because the state wasn't heavily targeted by Republicans during the primary, people are hungry for stuff -- pink Palin T-shirts included. Ironically, Pace -- who left his job as a location finder for a film production company during the writers' strike and began selling T-shirts -- is independent and "swayable" in this election. But he knows what pays the bills.
"Republicans have a lot more cash," he said. "I know where to go."
Pace declined to say who he'd vote for -- he believes McCain is a good man -- he's not as thrilled with Palin. He also thinks Obama's a good guy.
Would he consider selling Obama paraphernalia? "It's not that I wouldn't -- I'm a capitalist."
But he says there is an abundance of Obama stuff hawkers saturating the market.
9:36 a.m.
Janet Lubin's husband Gary, an Army sergeant, was in a Humvee in Iraq at 2:38 p.m. April 30, 2006, when it drove over an improvised explosive device. Shrapnel knocked out six teeth, broke apart his jaw and nearly severed his spinal cord. He is facing yet another surgery next month when his jaw will be rebroken and set. Still, he remains active duty Army and didn't show up today for McCain's town hall meeting only because he just returned home from Fort Hood early this morning.
Janet, though, couldn't pass up the opportunity to see the man she'd like to be the nation's next president. She brought along their 7-year-old son Will, who played around in line in his miniature sized tan fatigues, balancing the children's book "My dad, John McCain" on his tuft of blondish hair. The second grader at Talbott Elementary School in Colorado Springs was hoping to get the book signed, his mom said.
The 26-year-old Farmers Insurance sales representative of Colorado Springs said it was going to be her first Republican rally. She wanted to hear about McCain's tax policies. She doesn't agree with raising corporate taxes saying such a move just ends up hurting the working people.
When her son was asked about all this presidential election stuff, his mom attempted to que him: "What are we here for?"
"Talk," he answered.
"What are we here for?" mom asked again.
"John McCain."
9:26 a.m.
Vietnam veteran Vince Welsh, 64, who lives between Canon and Guffey, showed up to hear more about McCain's plans in Iraq. He is very critical of George Bush's policies there - even though he voted for him twice.
"What Bush was doing in the war, he was just playing around killing people," Welsh said, as he waited in a long line this morning. "Once he got (General) Patreus in there we started winning."
Welsh, who served in the 199th Infrantry Brigade, said McCain has the skill and knowledge to hit the ground running, clean up the mess in Afghanistan and continue to wrap up operations in Iraq. Welsh, has two grandchildren who have served in Iraq.
He also wants to hear what McCain has to say about the economy.
"I hope to hear him talk about some tax proposals he's going to put in," Welsh said, noting that he thought Palin did a great job in the debates but failed to be specific enough on the economy.
"The Palin talk wasn't definitive enough -- this is what we're going to do," he said. "That's what I want to hear." His 12-year-old grandson, Will Welsh, tagged along. The student at Canon City Middle School clearly wasn't interested in politics, though.
"It's something so I could get out of school," he said with a smirk.
9:18 a.m.
The lengthy line is beginning to snake inside the arena, where participants are undergoing a security screening. Organizers are assisting people with disabilities and asking everyone to have their tickets out. A row of TV live trucks sits outside the arena's doors. Overall, it's a peaceful scene, and there is no hint of any protesters despite the establishment of an adjacent free speech zone. Overall, this is a community crowd - not so many college students.
9:15 a.m.
Lil Pomeleo, 65, of Pueblo West, was in line by 6:45 a.m. snuggled in a coat sewn from a real American flag. Her husband Tom, 73, picked it up in California years ago.
The two Catholics were staunch Democrats until a few years ago when they felt the Democratic Party changed in ways they could not accept. They are pro-life and against gay marriage.
Today, they hope to hear Sen. John McCain talk about the economy and his plans to support American taxpayers.
"We believe in his policies and what he can do for us," she said, as they continued to wait in line at 9 a.m.
The couple voted for President Bush in the past two elections, and are among the dwindling number of Americans who continue to support him. They're huge fans of vice presidential pick Sarah Palin and almost sound like her grandparents when they talk about her.
"We're so proud of her. She really does stand for what she believes," said Lil, who teaches human relations at Pueblo Community College.
They were thrilled with her performance in last night's vice presidential debate.
As for Knight of Columbus Tom Pomeleo, wearing a navy blue Shrine of St. Therese jacket, he feels he lacks good information about Sen. Barack Obama.
"We want somebody in the White House who knows something. They talk about Palin doesn't know anything about foreign affairs - neither does Barack.
"We're afraid of his background," his wife chimed in.
"We're not getting all the information," Tom said. "He hasn't done anything. He hasn't voted on anything. I think (Joe) Biden would have made a better president - even Hillary."
In fact, Tom said he would have struggled to make a choice if Hillary Clinton had been the Democratic nominee.
8:48 a.m.
Hundreds of people are lining up this morning to see Republican Presidential Candidate John McCain bring his campaign to one of the biggest strongholds in Colorado for the Democratic Party – Pueblo.
Gary McCown, 44, of Pueblo West, and his 16-year-old son Chandler, left their home at 5:05 a.m. to be first in line. They arrived at 5:30 a.m., well before sunup with only T-shirts to keep them warm in the morning chill.
McCown is a government teacher at Pueblo West High School.
He said he came because it was “a chance to see and honor a hero. I think we should take that opportunity.”
McCown said he has been a McCain supporter for 20 years, since learning of McCain’s military background.
“Anyone who is willing to put their life on the line for me – I’m in their corner.” McCown said.
When asked about his issues he said he is most concerned about, McCown said he favors universal health care. He also said he would like to hear something different about plans for the economy other than the bailout package.
Chandler, who was wearing an iPod and appeared sleepy said, “It was a good chance to come out and see what he has to say.”
A day after conceding Michigan to his Democratic opponent, McCain’s swing state strategy in Colorado takes him to a county that has voted Republican five times in the last 22 presidential elections. Democrats outnumber Republicans nearly two to one in Pueblo County.
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October 3, 2008
9:25 a.m.
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UNV_ME writes:
Community flocks to McCain speech today in Pueblo.... like a flock of sheep blindly following the old sheepherder.
October 3, 2008
9:25 a.m.
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Cowboy63 writes:
This race is a marathon. If the vote were held today, Obama would win. Problem is - the vote ain't today.
I expect McCain to have 10 good days after last night debate and come out smokin' next Tuesday. I expect Obama to regroup and come back strong in the following debate and have a good 10 days then as well.
This is going to be decided in the last 10 days before Nov 4th. This isn't over yet, no matter which side you're on.
The current state of affairs - the bailout, Iraq, general public sentiment, etc. (not Obama's positions) pretty much assures a Dem victory, but don't start chilling the bubbly just yet.
Once the dust settles - half of this country is going to despise the other half. THAT is going to be the biggest challenge of the next President - whoever that may be.
October 3, 2008
9:36 a.m.
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SlouchingTowardBoulder writes:
"A day after conceding Michigan to his Democratic opponent, McCain’s ..."
This is editorializing by Julie Poppen in the guise of a news story because she is passing on what she reads off the AP wire. Truth is that McCain is reallocating resources but still plans on returning to Michigan via Palin. This has been just announced by the McCain campaign.
October 3, 2008
9:41 a.m.
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SlouchingTowardBoulder writes:
Why didn't Palin attack the Democrats on the bailout and what led up to it last night? Why hasn't McCain gone on the attack and expose Obama is the # 2 recipient of Fannie/Freddie campaign contributions, and mention that it was McCain who co-sponsored a regulatory oversight bill in 2005 but was beaten back by Democrats who are heavily invested in the Fannie/Freddie/ACORN scheme?
The answer? He's waiting. But it will come. It WILL come. See http://ace.mu.nu/archives/274764.php
"McCain Holding Back on Fannie and Freddie? Um... Wait For It
No confirmation on this, no tip, no hint.
But I know what he's doing.
John McCain is waiting until the bill passes.
And then he will unleash the dogs of war.
And he will say, "I stayed away from making these partisan attacks, even though you lied ridiculously about me and your own attempts at 'reform.' I held back, because partisan attacks -- even truthful ones -- would harm our country and reduce the chances of getting a vital bill passed.
"Well, the bill is now passed. I put country first. You didn't, and you lied on top of that. And now -- only now that this crisis has been dealt with, to the extent we can -- I'm going to give you a bit of straight-talk about Fannie, Freddie, my attempts to reform it, and your attempts to block reform on behalf of your big donors and friends in ACORN."
Count on it."
October 3, 2008
10 a.m.
Suggest removal
Nobama writes:
Where is the left wing Liberal support group today? Must be too early for them. They usually like to operate as a pack, cause it shores up their individual confidence and self-esteem and makes them think they can run with the big dogs.
But there IS this: UNV_ME writes:
Community flocks to McCain speech today in Pueblo.... like a flock of sheep blindly following the old sheepherder.
Now why would you go and say a thing like that? It's not relevant. It's only meant to be degrading and I'm getting tired of the "old guy" jokes. I think McCain might be too old, but so are the 16 Democrat Senate Committee chairs, including Joe Biden, who run the Senate. Their average age is 72, same as McCain. Most of them have never done anything but serve in the Senate, and they are mostly lawyers. (That's a combination that scares me, just like the Obama/Biden ticket.) Twelve of them are eligible for Medicare and one of them, Robert Byrd, who manages appropriations, is 90. How about dropping the hypocrisy about age, and give them the same treatment? After all, THEY are the ones who are going to help Obama CHANGE the way Washington works. Now that's a joke. And, don't leave out the House. Apply the same litmus test to Barney Frank, Charlie Rangel and Nancy Pelosi. Not exactly spring chickens, I must say. Your Colorado Democrat congressmen are joined at the hip with Pelosi and Co, but that's not "blindly" following some old person?
October 3, 2008
10:03 a.m.
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radagan writes:
Its a see-saw battle to the end. However it will come down to a few states such as Ohio, Virgina and Colorado.
McCain has real ideas and solutions to the economy, healthcare and the war in Iraq and Afghanistan. Obama has plans to implement several gov't programs of which there is not any money to pay for them. Obama says, I won't raise taxes on middle income people, but in fact he's always voted in the past to either raise taxes or not lower them. Not sure why people support someone who's always done the opposite of what they say they want to do.
Wake up and smell the coffee - there isn't money to pay for more and more gov't spending. McCain is the only one with guts to come out and say gov't spending MUST be reduced.
October 3, 2008
10:19 a.m.
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PonchoVia writes:
McCain abandons hope in Michigan; admits Obama will take the state:
http://www.startribune.com/politics/3...
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/0...
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/campai...
October 3, 2008
10:27 a.m.
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LingLingfor_prez writes:
I would abandon Michigan too. If that is the reality of the situation, why not move on?
October 3, 2008
10:28 a.m.
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cassidy22 writes:
Does candidates usually "abandon" a state? I can see not going back for visits, but actually stating that you are abandoning efforts in a state? That seems weird to me. And seems like it might turn off any folks on the fence, which both parties need right now.
October 3, 2008
11:14 a.m.
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DenverDan writes:
The old man needs to retire and work on his bucket list.
October 3, 2008
11:18 a.m.
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spreadthelove writes:
Stay in Michigan! Don't give up!
October 3, 2008
11:22 a.m.
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Cowboy63 writes:
Big_D writes: "The GOP is trying to distance it's self from the GOP."
???
Just for a little remedial:
Main Entry: co·her·ent
Function: adjective
1 a: logically or aesthetically ordered or integrated : consistent <coherent style> <a coherent argument> b: having clarity or intelligibility : understandable <a coherent person> <a coherent passage>
October 3, 2008
11:37 a.m.
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SlouchingTowardBoulder writes:
Big_D writes:
Getting us out of Iraq saves 10 Billion a month.
And that's but one of the glaring problems with Dems and Obama. More than willing to lose a war. And isn't it interesting that Obama can't wait to flee Iraq but has no problem getting involved in Darfur??
Check out Robert McFarlane's piece today in the Wall Street Journal:
Obama Was Willing to Lose in Iraq
A president cannot treat a war as if it's a game.
By ROBERT MCFARLANE
A profoundly important point is being missed in the campaign debate over which candidate was right on Iraq. In 2006, when conditions on the ground were trending downward and a decision was required either to continue the struggle or to cut our losses, Barack Obama stated that the proposed deployment of more forces, the "surge," was doomed to failure and instead called for a phased withdrawal of all forces within a defined period.
In short, Sen. Obama was willing to lose. It was an astonishing display of ignorance to be so cavalier about defeat, almost as if losing a war was tantamount to losing a set of tennis -- something without lasting consequence.
snip
There were consequences for all nations, especially small states who are vulnerable to great-power pressures. In the late 1970s it contributed to a greater Russian willingness to take risks and a more aggressive Soviet foreign policy.
snip
Losing a war also affects our body politic. Americans have a low tolerance for foreign wars; losing one only reinforces their inclination to avoid foreign involvement and focus on matters here at home. Now is such a time. Yet can you imagine how much worse our political stability would be today -- faced with the financial and housing crises -- if we were also coming home from losing a war?
snip
The next president will enter office with the war in Iraq winding down but with the conflict in Afghanistan requiring urgent, focused attention. The stakes engaged there go well beyond restoring order in that country alone. How we emerge from Afghanistan will go far toward determining our ability to prevail in the global war against radical Islam, our ability to limit nuclear proliferation, and to bring order and the hope for a brighter future to the almost two billion people in South and Central Asia. These are issues of profound importance to the future security of our nation and our citizens. Losing is not an option, and no sensible leader should entertain the thought that it is.
Mr. McFarlane served as President Reagan's National Security Adviser from 1983-85.
October 3, 2008
11:45 a.m.
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WestminsterJ writes:
Cowboy63: I don't agree with you often, but that's a pretty comment; I agree.
October 3, 2008
11:47 a.m.
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timeandagain writes:
As Palin has evidenced since her candidacy... A WOMAN'S PLACE IS IN THE HOME!
October 3, 2008
11:56 a.m.
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DenverDan writes:
Slouching
What is wining the war to you? Were we ever losing the war?
You would think after 8 years we would be winning? Or should we be there for 100 years. Maybe they can pay for us to be there. Your boy said "Mission Accomplished" over 20,000 days ago.
October 3, 2008
12:09 p.m.
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clyde writes:
20,000 days??? That's almost 56 years ago. Nice bit of Dem math.
October 3, 2008
12:24 p.m.
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Mayor_Quimby writes:
"Cutting the giveaways John McCain supported for oil saves us over 18 Billion a year."
How bout the $300 billion energy bill that obama voted for the McCain did not that gave away money to the oil companies? Little hole in your saviors story there...
October 3, 2008
12:29 p.m.
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SlouchingTowardBoulder writes:
Dem favorite Harry Truman got us into the Korean Conflict. We're still there.
October 3, 2008
12:32 p.m.
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INC writes:
clyde,
ok so its around 2000 days "mission accomplished" was declared. by your "leader".
October 3, 2008
12:34 p.m.
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dragonfly writes:
Big-D,
Obama's nearly trillion dollar spending plan taken from Newsweek:
A $65 billion-a-year health plan
$15 billion in green energy spending
$85 billion in tax cuts and credits
A $25 billion-a-year increase in foreign aid
$18 billion a year in education spending
$3.5 billion for a national service plan
Put it all together, and we are talking about a $200 billon plan, $800 billion over four years.
OUCH!!!
October 3, 2008
12:46 p.m.
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Nosybear writes:
Of course the crowd was appreciative - they took their time and energy to go see McCain. This is equally as meaningless a point as that crowds who voluntarily go to see Obama are appreciative. In either case, the attendees are generally followers and as such, would tend to be appreciative.
In short, the headline to this story was much like telling us the sun rose this morning, a waste of ink. Now we get to the crux of the matter, the reason I no longer take the Rocky - inept, useless reporting.
October 3, 2008
12:50 p.m.
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expatman writes:
I understand that McCain wants "victory with honor" in Iraq but I don't understand EXACTLY what that means as I have never heard him define it. I have heard our maximum leader say something to the effect of "victory in Iraq means a peaceful, democratic, stable country that will be a beacon of freedom in the region". If anybody believes that is going to happen, ever, they need to change their medications. If that is our standard our troops should be home by, oh say, 2100.
October 3, 2008
1:03 p.m.
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chickenlittle1234 writes:
Just saw McCain's photo covering this story - man, that's one forced looking grimace.
October 3, 2008
1:07 p.m.
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mrtaco writes:
my friends, my campaign is over. my friends, i am out of touch. my friends, where is my applesauce?
October 3, 2008
1:51 p.m.
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Nobama writes:
Just checking back. Sure enough, the Liberal support group DID show up today, in full force. I'll bet you all feel better now, hunting with the pack, regurgitating the same old tired Liberal slogans that you use ever day. You kinda remind me of that old TV show, Laugh In. You know, where they get behind the fascade with all the little doors and take turns saying one-liners? Then, they all dutifully laugh at each other's joke. But, they had to routinely ask: was that another chicken joke? Well, the McCain lines are worn out. This isn't about "supporting" McCain, as much as it is not "following" Obama. Do you want our current form of government, hopefully with more fiscal constraint and integrity? Or do you really believe that Obama is going to take care of all all problems by building and funding a bigger Federal government, nationalizing big corportions and whole industries, and redistributing wealth? For those of you with the rose colored glasses, that latter alternative approaches Socialism. The least you could do is admit it.
October 3, 2008
2:08 p.m.
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Devil_Dog writes:
Big_D writes:
Raising windfall profits on oil companies could have given us 300 billion more dollars over the past four years.
Of the many ignorant things I see you write on a daily basis this is really stupid. If by this statement you are talking about raising the windfall tax on oil companies, where do you think that money will come from?
Let me help you with that difficult question... It will come out of the pockets of the consumer in the forrm of even higher prices at the pump.
October 3, 2008
2:10 p.m.
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Nobama writes:
Big_D writes:
"I thought Bush declared victory a few years back. We are just occupying this country and they don't want us."
AND MORE?
"What is victory in Iraq you Republican supporters? Please give me a clear plan since you know John's plan. Be precise and give examples and benchmarks. If you fail I will take it that your plan is empty rhetoric with our servicemen paying the price for his incompetence and ego."
Once again, you have assumed the role of moderator? Well, I don't accept your premise or your ultimatim. This is not a normal war, historically, unless you want to abandon the effort and declare defeat. The military action can be completed when all the Iraqi provinces are under the security of the Iraqi government, but that could relapse thereafter. I'm sorry your whole "timetable" and plan theory doesn't neatly fit the situation here, but I think it's a logical approach. And that tired old Liberal rant about "mission accomplished" just shows us how little appreciation or understanding you have for military operations. Can you not see different increments and levels of operations between individual missions, battles, and wars? Maybe you should ask somebody who has actually served. "Mission Accomplished" is actually a very limited segment of larger operations. Ask John McCain. He can explain to you the distinct definitions of sorties, missions, battles and wars. I doubt if you really care.
October 3, 2008
2:50 p.m.
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marct writes:
The GOP is deliberately confusing a plan with a goal. A goal is something you are trying to attain. A plan is how you reach that goal. So is "Victory in Iraq" a plan? Is "democracy in Iraq" a plan? A plan has specific objectives and timetables to determine how you achieve the goal. Staying in Iraq and paying off various Islamic factions is not a plan to achieving democracy. If you have to pay your potential adversaries to not attack you (as we are doing) doesn't solve the final problem. Because what happens if/when you leave? Those factions will start exerting their power, using that money to acquire better weapons, train their militias, and move against opposing factions. And in Iraq, there are many factions, inter-Islamic sect factions like Shia vs. Sunni vs. Kurdish, and then there's Intra-Islamic sect (Shia vs. Shia).
That, coupled with the issue that some of those factions want the oil revenues and would rather the others don't get the same, and the population split (~65% Shia, ~32% Sunni) plus the recent history (Sunni rule over Iraq during Saddam's reign) means the Shia would rule over a democratic Iraq to the detriment of the Sunni/Kurd. Which is why Bush Sr. stopped when he did during Desert Storm, as it opens up a hornets nest that would prove expensive and difficult to get out of, as Bush Jr. has proven.
October 3, 2008
3:16 p.m.
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AC writes:
Cowboy63 writes: "Big_D writes: "The GOP is trying to distance it's self from the GOP."
"???"
Cowboy, you need the remedial. It's a reference to the fact that some Rethugs are distancing themselves from their own party. In Washington state, some Republican candidates are not listing "Republican" after their names on the ballots in order to confuse voters into thinking they might actually be viable candidates and able office-holders.
October 3, 2008
4:44 p.m.
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youme writes:
Bank Loans Have Not 'Dried Up'
by Alan Reynolds
Alan Reynolds is a senior fellow with the Cato Institute and the author of Income and Wealth.
This article appeared on Forbes.com on October 1, 2008
The frantic congressional push to "do something" about mortgage-backed bank investments has been widely defended with equally frantic claims that U.S. bank lending to business and consumers has been shrinking fast.
On Sept. 24, Congressional Budget Office Director Peter Orszag warned Congress that "short-term lending was virtually shut down." The following day, The Washington Post reported that "tightening [bank] credit conditions are already affecting some consumers and business." Just before the $700 billion deal was announced on Sunday, an alarmed Fox News anchor said, "McDonald's can't even get a loan." (That comment confused a few franchise owners with the company.)
On CNBC Monday, Democrat majority leader Steny Hoyer said the objective of the rescue package is to "unlock the credit" for consumers and business. And a Wall Street Journal editorial writer told CNBC, "Until we get the banks lending again, the economy will continue to contract."
Such alarming comments never mention any facts. Why not? As Neil Cavuto recently noted on Fox Business News, the Fed reports bank loans every week.
Table One
U.S. Bank Loans (Billions of Dollars)
Federal Reserve Board, Asset and Liabilities of Commercial Banks in the United States (H.8).
In August, bank loans to consumers were 9.5% higher than they were a year earlier--the fastest increase since 2004. The year-to-year increase in consumer and industrial loans was 15.5%, down only slightly from a recent record high of 21.6% in March. Real estate loans were up 4.1% for the 12-month period ending this August--flat lately, but not down.
Did bank lending suddenly turn south since August? The latest data is for the week ending Sept.17, when the U.S. expropriated 80% of AIG (nyse: AIG - news - people ) equity and thus tanked most financial stocks. U.S. bank credit hit a record of over $7 trillion in the latest week--up from $6.57 trillion a year earlier and $6.92 trillion at the end of July.
Contrary to many comments, consumer and industrial loans actually increased in the latest week. Troubled giant banks have cut back on lending, but smaller banks have picked up the slack. Consumer and real estate loans dipped insignificantly through Sept. 17, remaining much higher than they were a year earlier.
If all the recent hysterical chatter about lending being "frozen" or "shut down" refers to anything real, it is not about banks loans (through Sept. 17) but about such arcane financial markets as asset-backed commercial paper or loans between banks. But this too is mainly about financial firms, not Main Street. Non-financial commercial paper increased from $156 billion at the start of the year to more than $204 billion from Sept. 3 to Sept. 17, dipping only modestly since then.
October 3, 2008
5:28 p.m.
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Nobama writes:
Big_D writes:
"I thought Bush declared victory a few years back."
I've been thinking about this statement by Big_D and it still bothers me. Let me pose a specific and simple question to the anti-Bush crowd, in a civil manner. I would appreciate any equally specific and simple answer(s), also in a civil manner. Whatever the answer(s) are, I will not respond with any rebuttal. I’m just curious about the application of Liberal logic. OK? Here goes. Within the context of military operations and vernacular, how can you conclude that the term “mission accomplished” was ever intended to convey that the Iraqi war was over?
Of course, I'd like to hear from Big_D first, but all responses are welcome.
October 3, 2008
7:08 p.m.
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diggtbks writes:
SlouchingTowardBoulder writes:
"Dem favorite Harry Truman got us into the Korean Conflict. We're still there"
That comment's worth 10 points...lol