Man with knife forced 'suicide by cop,' DA says
Coroner's report finds alcohol, drugs in system
By Katie Kerwin McCrimmon, Rocky Mountain News (Contact)
Published July 11, 2008 at 2:56 p.m.
Updated July 11, 2008 at 11:33 p.m.
Odiceo Valencia used a butcher knife to slit his left wrist.
A coroner's report released Friday says that a knife-wielding man, killed by Denver police at a family party in May, had cocaine, amphetamine and alcohol in his system when officers shot him.
Denver District Attorney Mitch Morrissey has found that Denver officers were justified in shooting Odiceo Valencia, 45, after he refused to drop a knife and kept moving toward one of the officers.
The district attorney concluded that Valencia committed "suicide by cop."
In the Montbello neighborhood where the shooting occurred, a small memorial marks the spot where Valencia was shot. Plastic flowers adorn a makeshift cross with Valencia's name. A brown balloon reading, "World's Greatest Dad," is tied to a nearby tree.
Valencia's daughter, Carolina, said her family would not comment on the district attorney's findings.
"We don't know what we're going to do yet," she said and referred inquiries to insurance adjustor and investigator Donald Fymbo.
Fymbo said that he has videotaped testimony from six witnesses disputing the officers' accounts that Valencia remained armed with the knife when he was gunned down.
The shooting enraged Valencia's family and sparked anti- police sentiment in Montbello.
Family members were distraught that they witnessed the shooting and blamed police for inflaming the situation by encouraging Valencia to return to the family home. The officers told investigators they wanted Valencia to return to the house so that paramedics could care for a self-inflicted wound to his wrist.
The shooting erupted as the family celebrated the First Communion of Valencia's daughter.
Morrissey's report gives the following account:
Valencia, who had moved out of the family home, showed up at the church and the party afterward.
His wife had obtained a restraining order against him after months of fights had escalated.
Valencia's son said his dad was drunk and threatened to kill himself then took a butcher knife and sliced open his left wrist.
Valencia then left the house but kept calling back.
During one of those phone calls, Valencia's son handed the phone to police, who urged Valencia to return to the home and have paramedics attend to his injuries.
When Valencia returned, officers Chris Cesarec, Chris Pappas and Tony Bruce said he threatened Cesarec and chased him around a van while holding a knife. Officers tried to subdue him with a taser and pepper balls but said Valencia continued to threaten Cesarec.
Morrissey found that the officers were justified because they tried to use nonlethal force and Valencia continued to pose a threat.
In his report, Morrissey found that Cesarec kept trying to back away, but Valencia kept moving toward him.
"For reasons known only to Valencia, his suicidal actions and statements prior to police involvement and during the confrontation are consistent with an intention to force the police to shoot him - commonly referred to as 'suicide by cop,' " Morrissey concluded.
Staff writer Hector Gutierrez contributed to this report.
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July 11, 2008
1:15 p.m.
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Devil_Dog writes:
If you're doing something stupid and a cop is screaming at you IN ANY language it is safe to assume you should stop whatever it is that you are doing.
July 11, 2008
1:16 p.m.
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denverrma writes:
Another good reason to learn the language of the country you choose to live in.
July 11, 2008
1:17 p.m.
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RMN08READER writes:
You're right - a deaf person would be able to tell from a person's body language and facial expressions the level of urgency being communicated by the police officers - not all communication is verbal! Great point FREETHOUGHT!
July 11, 2008
1:32 p.m.
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Cowboy63 writes:
This old story again?
This guy was a drunken loser who proves the point, "it pays to know the language of the cops you are waving a knife at".
July 11, 2008
1:37 p.m.
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scootertrash writes:
The loser got what he deserved, maybe the rest of them living here might consider learning the english language now.
July 11, 2008
1:40 p.m.
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davies writes:
The cops should be equipped with extra-long feathers for tickling confrontational perpertrators into submission.
July 11, 2008
1:42 p.m.
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Sundog writes:
I think police officers should learn Polish and Mandarin just in case. You never know.
July 11, 2008
1:47 p.m.
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sheepherder writes:
davies..now that was funny! Good for the cops, they did a great job on this one! Justice served!
July 11, 2008
2:06 p.m.
woods_b writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
July 11, 2008
2:06 p.m.
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CIS247 writes:
I just 'love' our "LEO friendly" media...
"exonerates cops in SLAYING"
and
"GUNNING down a man"
Not as good a headline or story if its stated as "Police exonerated in 'Justified use of Deadly Force' against a man wielding a deadly weapon, who charged at officers several times and was non-compliant to commands given several times, along with the use of less-than-lethal equipment that proved to be ineffectual against the suspect".
Great job on all the DPD officer's part, and great job on the Denver DA's office for finding the DPD Officers in justified use of force!!!
I guess it just goes to show in our media... "If it bleeds, it leads!!!"
July 11, 2008
2:13 p.m.
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SickNTired writes:
Woods-b "Pigs! They can get away with anything.
What do you think would have happened if that man was white??"
He'd be dead too. Now what do you want to whine about?
July 11, 2008
2:26 p.m.
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scootertrash writes:
If the man was white, he would have understood English, if he still threatened the cops he would be dead also!!!
July 11, 2008
2:35 p.m.
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Violet writes:
Valencia understood English when the officers called him back to his wife's house. And that seems like a much more detailed conversation than the word 'STOP' or even 'DROP THE KNIFE'.
July 11, 2008
2:40 p.m.
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Buckwheat writes:
Moral of the story?? Duh! Never bring a knife to a gun fight.
July 11, 2008
2:41 p.m.
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redwhiteandBLUE writes:
It had to be suicide by cop.
July 11, 2008
2:46 p.m.
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MissyBitchCakes writes:
I'm so tired of the stories summed up with "had restraining order, called cops/used cops instead of common sense/parenting/personal responsibility, surprised by terrible outcome, so blame the cops." No matter what his color/language skills, etc, he was cutting himself in front of his family, and CHASING the cops with a knife. That's seriously aggressive behavior. I'd have shot him, too. It's too bad he's dead, but I think he created this situation on his own.
July 11, 2008
3:02 p.m.
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FlyfishDude52 writes:
10-4 Buckwheat!
I don't care if the guy was drunk & couldn't think clearly. I'm guessing that was self-induced.
This could be considered a Darwinian outcome.
July 11, 2008
3:03 p.m.
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SteveC writes:
He violated a restraining order. The cops used nonlethal force at least TWICE. He had a weapon. He was chasing the cops, with a weapon. I don't care if he understood English or not. Everybody knows you don't chase a cop with a weapon, you don't even pull a weapon on them. He was hit with pepper balls and a taser. What were the cops supposed to do? They gave him every chance to stop his aggressive behavior and he still came at them. I may not speak any other languages but I know enough to stop when they pull their guns. I know enough to stop when they hit me with pepper balls. I know enough to stop when they hit me with a taser. The cops were left with no other actions. They had to protect themselves as well as any other people who were nearby.
July 11, 2008
3:05 p.m.
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Marshdale writes:
I don't blame the police officers in this case. They were protecting themselves and others from who knows what this guy was going to do. I would like to know what the DPD's policy is with regard to using tasers on someone with a knife. Just curious.
P.S. Just because someone might be illegal, why do we have to have all of the nasty comments? Can't you guys be a little bit more intellectual about this?
July 11, 2008
3:13 p.m.
Suggest removal
peachy0301 writes:
Its a shame the author of this piece didn't research the story a little more. There is alot more to this story that the talk show hosts in Denver discovered that neither paper ever bothered to discover - or if they did, decided not to print. He had a long (!!) history of problems - with drinking, domestic violence, criminal mischief, forgery, petty theft, violating court orders, assault, driving with no license, driving with no insurance, driving with suspended plates - just to name a few. He's had enough run-ins with police that he knew better. He knew what he was doing. Did you notice how soon this story went away - until now? Because at the time the papers realized their error in publicizing this case the way they did.
July 11, 2008
3:20 p.m.
Suggest removal
happymike44 writes:
Well look who brought a knife to a gun fight.
Wonder if he could understandcome back to the house.
Why couldn't he understan drop the knife.
Wonder was it the booze that really caused the problems.
Wonder if his ex-wife feels responsible for this little disaster she created.
Poor unlucky b-stard to die at the hands of law enforcement.
July 11, 2008
3:32 p.m.
Suggest removal
wow writes:
Mike,
Why jump on the exwife for the behavior of the idiot exhusband?
I figure his wacked out behavior was probably what lead her to divorce the loser. How is this in any way a "little disaster she created"?
July 11, 2008
3:41 p.m.
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wow writes:
And as for being unlucky to die at the hands of law enforcement...they put him down because he left them no other choice. No luck involved, just natural consequences.
I think it could have ended a lot worse for every one, if not for the actions of these cops.
July 11, 2008
3:55 p.m.
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wow writes:
YIOTA and Ricky Lee are very lucky that WOW is a nice lady and not a stalker type.
Bawahahahaha.
July 11, 2008
4:59 p.m.
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melvinlajace writes:
why is that a man with a knife gets killed? isnt that excessive force. I hate how you idiots get on here and just write off a life. you guys are sick. he had a knife, Those cops have other weapons that could have been used, Mace, or those big sticks they call flashlights, Cops are cowards with a shoot first attitude, my heart goes out to the mans family. didnt the police kill him in front of his kids?? You guys think this is ok?? You guys are really sick. All they had to do was mace the poor guy, or tase him. This story makes me sick to my stomach
July 11, 2008
5:19 p.m.
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wow writes:
Melvin---
"Tony Bruce said he threatened Cesarec and chased him around a van while holding a knife. Officers tried to subdue him with a taser and pepper balls but said Valencia continued to threaten Cesarec."<< from the above article, that some one should have read.
Further on you will note that one of the taser prongs was still in the guy's forehead. It wasn't effective on him, because he had lost his ever-loving mind. You cannot reason with or gently subdue a crazy person.
And if his kids saw what was going on, is that also the fault of the cops? Should they have simply let the madman stab them repeatedly while they beat him into submission on the lawn in front of the kids instead? Maybe the kids shouldn't have ever been subjected to contact with a criminal, a man who terrified them, to begin with. After all, the call was from the family, because the lunatic was there, drunk, and in violation of a Restraining Order, requested by them themselves, not by the cops. Can you see what I'm getting at, yet?
The family should be thanking the police for protecting them from a madman with a knife, rather than dishing abuse, and whining about the lot in life of their dear departed.
Some people have such blind and illogical hate for authority that no matter what happens, the law is just WRONG.
I feel for you if you ever need them.
And BTW--I'm not a big Cop Lover. I just know right from wrong.
July 11, 2008
5:28 p.m.
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LadyBird112 writes:
"Officers tried to subdue him with a taser and pepper balls but said Valencia continued to threaten Cesarec."
Well Melvin, there goes your theory.
July 11, 2008
5:32 p.m.
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LadyBird112 writes:
While I was busy registering, wow got there first. Good job :-)
July 11, 2008
6:03 p.m.
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JustSayin writes:
Why ever bother with the reviews - the results are phoned in, again, and again, and again, and..............
July 11, 2008
8 p.m.
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Uno writes:
So Valencia could speak English only on the phone (“Valencia's son handed the phone to police, who urged Valencia to return to the home”) ? Yeah, right. Cops did a good job.
July 11, 2008
8:26 p.m.
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The_Punnisher writes:
YAWN...This is news? It will only be news if the DA finds the cops did something bad....
And that is as rare as a " Man Bites Dog " story....
July 11, 2008
8:48 p.m.
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glock27 writes:
I was trained that anyone with a knife, aggressively advancing within 15 feet gets shot. Even at that, anyone as drugged as this loser could still do serious damage before going down.
The cops did quite a bit more than they had to.
July 11, 2008
9:26 p.m.
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Mike846 writes:
The police went above and beyond being reasonable before gunning down this drunken, abusive man. If they wouldn't have handled it the way they did, and he injured or killed a family member, THEN the lawsuit and racist epithets would have been "We TOLD them he was dangerous, but the cops don't care about Hispanics. They should have stopped him." I'm sure a search of the newspaper morgues can turn up just such accusations. Men in Blue, well done. Mike
July 11, 2008
9:35 p.m.
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kdubya writes:
I applaud the popo for shouting in English, after all this is America. Heaven forbid people learn the language of the country in which they live.
July 11, 2008
9:36 p.m.
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sheepherder writes:
Gock...it's 21 feet...
July 11, 2008
10:03 p.m.
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glock27 writes:
sheepherder:
My point exactly.
July 11, 2008
10:10 p.m.
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sheepherder writes:
Melvin, you are just ignorant. This moron chose the time and place he would die, not the cops. My guess is most cops can go a career without shooting anyone, but this idiot changed that for these officers, not the other way around. If he got shot in front of his kids...his fault, nobody elses. Quit defending scumbag criminals, you will be a better person for it. OH...and pay you tickets!
July 11, 2008
10:12 p.m.
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sheepherder writes:
Melvin has clearly never been in a fight, let alone having someone trying to stab you. What is your Comcast bill every month! Dear god man, all those movie channels must cost a bundle!
July 11, 2008
10:17 p.m.
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glock27 writes:
sheepherder:
To clarify a bit. I know that the official number is 21 feet (for what it is worth), but the story implies that things went way beyond that.
"...he threatened Cesarec and chased him around a van while holding a knife." That means he was 10-15 feet away. He should have been shot then. Officer Cesarec put himself at serious risk to avoid lethal force; he deserves a medal .
July 11, 2008
10:23 p.m.
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sheepherder writes:
Agreed 100% Glock! These cops al deserve a medal, they went wayyyy beyond! Two orders to drop to bullets is the norm, the way it should be.
July 11, 2008
10:30 p.m.
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sheepherder writes:
And I should clarify...if someone is CHASING a cop with a knife, no orders are needed...fill em full of lead.
July 12, 2008
1:54 a.m.
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LOUIE writes:
"...cocaine, amphetamines, and alcohol..". in the veins of a wife beater with a knife in his hand, chasing the cops; hard to say what language the man understands, it sure isn't one I'd say matters. Bet if I was standing in the streets of Panama, speaking yiddish in this man condition, with cocaine, amphetamines and alcohol running through my scrambled brains, I'd get shot looking the law eye to eye too. It always somebody else's fault, nobody accepts responsibility for thier own actions. Who called the cops in the first place, I believe it was his family. Guess who really got pops killed!
July 12, 2008
8:32 a.m.
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vet64 writes:
While I'm not a big fan of the Denver police dept, in this case I'll have to say that they were justified in using deadly force. Now if only they'd use more restraint in the future instead of shoot first - make excuses later.
July 12, 2008
11:23 a.m.
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MRSTTYLER writes:
RMANDERSON
YOU ARE SO RIGHT LEARN THE LANGUAGE.
July 12, 2008
11:47 a.m.
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denverone writes:
Seriously, have you ever heard a hispanic or black thank the police for anything?? This guy was a whacked out loser with a restraining order, chasing and waiving around a frickin knife people!! These police officers did their job by the book.
Thank you to these officers and all officers for risking your lives everyday to protect the ungrateful citizens of this country.
I am one of the few people that understand that the people among us that truly dislike police officers, are the CRIMINALS and COWARDS that wouldn't risk their lives to save their own mother.
July 12, 2008
2:48 p.m.
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dirty writes:
I can't believe there are still people blaming the cops for this.
This guy, regardless of his immigrant status was a worthless wife beating, violent junkie criminal.
The family for all their posturing, together with their "witnesses" (who have changed stories multiple times already)will not get a dime should this be put in front of a jury...but been Chickenlooper, who knows what will happen.
Maybe this guy was set up by his "loving family".
July 12, 2008
5:16 p.m.
Suggest removal
theairdog writes:
You know, just the other day we responded to a restaurant that was supposed to be closed with people moving around in it reported by a passerby.
When we went in to clear the building as a possible burglary in progress, we found a Mexican Cook there who didn't speak English - and we didn't speak Spanish.
Yet, when we pointed our guns at him (what you have to do until you positively identify them) he got the message at once and raised his hands and stopped what he was doing.
No translation was neccessary and nobody got hurt.
July 12, 2008
6:17 p.m.
Suggest removal
MOTRVIEW writes:
I think the next time a situation like this arises we should simply send "melvin" to handle the situation. He can bring his "stick and flashlight". I have a real good idea where the stick and flashlight will wind up !
July 12, 2008
6:40 p.m.
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redwhiteandBLUE writes:
Just like I said! 7-11 @2:41..SUICIDE BY COP!!!
That wasn't hard to figure out. restraining order, alienated
from his family , brokenhearted, now was from the outside looking in to a celebration that he wasn't a part of, drugs ,alcohol and slashing himself with his knife, waving a knife to the police...
It was just a matter of time before some drama would happen. Too
bad for the children.
July 12, 2008
7:09 p.m.
Suggest removal
theairdog writes:
Melvin,
My son used to feel exactly the same way as you did. The reason why he thought the way he did, was because he was ignorant (means untrained) and had no
experience.
Then he spent 3 years in the Special Forces in Iraq and Afghanistan. He came back, and went through the Police Academy. Now he understands and feels the way the Police Officers did in this situation. The ONLY thing that changed was that he became educated in combat and gained experience.
You believe they way you do because all of your knowledge and experience concerning responding to a man armed with a knife, comes from movies and TV. You have no actual experience or training.
You also are uninformed as to what the law says. Both Civilians and Cops are held to exactly the same standard. If you are the innocent victim of an attack (which applies to both Civilians and to the Police who responded to this call) you DO NOT have to respond with the same level of force.
Deadly force is allowed whenever you confront someone who you reasonably believe is about to cause you Serious Bodily Injury or Death. If a 300 pound guy tells a 120 pound guy that he is going to break his skull - it is reasonable to assume that he is going to do exactly that - and deadly force may be used in response. A knife is ALWAYS assumed to be able to cause SBI or death.
Educate yourself.
Here is some reading for you:
http://www.michie.com/colorado/lpext....
July 12, 2008
10:03 p.m.
Suggest removal
Finding_Forever writes:
I work with the DPD alot in my field of work, and honestly most of them are a wacked out bunch of criminals themselves, but if what they say is true then I definitely believe their actions were justified. I wish the DPD would install dash cams, that way the truth would always come out, guaranteed.
July 13, 2008
12:32 a.m.
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fastnloose writes:
My tax dollars were well spent in this incident.Way to go DPD!