KRIEGER: Nuggets' salaries not paying off
By Dave Krieger, Rocky Mountain News (Contact)
Published February 11, 2008 at 12:45 a.m.
Should the Nuggets make a trade before the Feb. 21 trade deadline?
Photo by Steve Yeater / Associated Press
Sacramento Kings forward Ron Artest is at the center of trade rumors involving the Nuggets. Nene was mentioned in one rumor, and Eduardo Najera and possibly Linas Kleiza also have been mentioned in a package deal.
Mark Heisler of the Los Angeles Times, who has been covering pro basketball since the pick-and-roll was an experiment, took a moment on Sunday to go over the top teams in the West in the wake of the big recent trades.
The Lakers, with the acquisition of Pau Gasol and the forthcoming return of Andrew Bynum, are an "emerging giant," he wrote. So are the young Trail Blazers, who will add last year's top draft pick, Greg Oden, next season.
Then he mentioned the traditional powers in San Antonio, Phoenix and Dallas, and the "young comers" in Utah and New Orleans.
Then he pointed out he still hadn't talked about Yao Ming and the Rockets, who won 52 games last season.
That's an entire playoff bracket without the Nuggets, the only team that boasts two starters on the Western Conference All-Star team, although the case for Portland is more about the future than this season.
Magic Johnson was sitting courtside Sunday as the Pau-full Lakers beat the Heat in Miami. ABC sideline reporter Lisa Salters asked for his take on the West. He mentioned the Lakers, Spurs, Suns, Mavericks and Rockets, then the Nuggets and Jazz.
I can only guess, since he doesn't exactly share, but I'm thinking this was not what Silent Stanley Kroenke had in mind when he approved an $80 million payroll - third highest in the NBA - that will actually cost more like $94 million with the luxury tax.
So any discussion about what the Nuggets should do in advance of the Feb. 21 trade deadline must start there.
Ron Artest, the most popular trade rumor, is making $7.4 million this season, with a player option for $7.4 million next season. The Kings have to think about moving him because he can decline his option and walk away as a free agent this summer.
The original rumor had the Nuggets swapping Nene for Artest, which would make them smaller while everyone else is getting bigger. But Nene is out indefinitely with testicular cancer, and more recent speculation has focused on a package including Eduardo Najera and possibly Linas Kleiza.
This would strip the Nuggets of two of their most important role players and leave them with six players making at least $7.4 million - Allen Iverson, Carmelo Anthony, Kenyon Martin, Nene, Marcus Camby and Artest.
With more than $75 million already committed for next season, the Nuggets would be forced to choose between a payroll-expanding long-term deal for Artest and the risk of losing him for nothing after a short-term rental.
There have already been indications that even a billionaire's checkbook has its limits. Signing Chucky Atkins instead of Steve Blake during the offseason was a good move only from a salary standpoint, and Atkins' injuries have made it an expensive savings.
The failure to address three-point shooting woes that have repeatedly hurt them in the playoffs can only be interpreted as a budgetary constraint. The Celtics signed James Posey for a very modest package. Posey is shooting 41.4 percent from long range. The Nuggets, at 33.5 percent, rank in the bottom half of the league again.
Artest would certainly improve the Nuggets' perimeter defense (as Posey would have), which is another weakness.
But he's an expensive solution to that problem and he would produce new problems of his own. At 6-foot-7, Artest should play shooting guard or small forward. Iverson and Anthony staff those spots for the Nuggets.
So coach George Karl would either have to move Iverson to point guard permanently to make room for Artest - and they've tried that before, with limited success - or push Anthony or Artest up to power forward, where either would be out of position and the Nuggets as a team would be smaller just as the Lakers and Suns are getting bigger.
By acquiring Shaquille O'Neal last week, the Suns gave up on their experiment of a small starting lineup with a small forward playing power forward and a power forward playing center. It would be a strange time for the Nuggets to adopt a similar experiment.
And we haven't yet touched on Artest's volatile personality, on display lately in Sacramento as he has gotten unhappier with the Kings. Presumably, he would be on his best behavior in his early days with a new team, as he was early on in Sacramento, but he's a long-term time bomb.
The alternative is to pass on Artest, maybe pick up a point guard to fill in for Atkins and hope Nene can return down the stretch.
Still, the Nuggets' three-headed front office might feel it has to do something more meaningful. The nine best teams in the West were within five games going into Sunday's action. The Nuggets are closer to the bottom of that pack than the top.
Silent Stanley is spending a lot of money on what has to date been mostly a great fantasy team, putting up better individual statistics than team performance. So far, the Nuggets have been less than the sum of their parts.
It's hard to imagine the unpredictable Artest solving a chemistry problem, but the Nuggets' choices are limited. With their competitors loading up for the playoffs, the pressure is growing to roll the dice.
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February 10, 2008
7:39 p.m.
Suggest removal
Polego writes:
The Nuggets should feel every ounce of heat for letting the success of their season come down to this decision. What a horrendous failure of inexcusible proportions.
Deal K-mart, who's quality of play equals his moniker namesake. He's a head case who's either whinning, punking out, or injured. When things are on the line, he's vacant, absent, MIA, and any other synonym meaning 'zero-impact'.
Then you have Carmelo 'Can't play team ball if my life depended on it' Anthony... please. He's proving to be an overpaid playground baller with some excellent skills, but it's becoming doubtful if he'll ever transfer from immaturety to greatness. Nene (no disrespect to his current health) is the absolute softest big man I've ever seen. A weak-in-the-paint marshmallow who's easily outmanuevered or flat outmanned, with maybe a few games of decent play. Finally, you have 'Tired George', who's passion and drive for coaching left the building sometime ago. He's a past 'Great Name' coach with excellent historic success coach, but whos now collecting a check folks.
The Denver Nuggets franchise continues to not be taken seriously because they fail to act seriously. I feel bad for AI, Camby, Najera, and Kleiza. They're currently the only true night-in/night-out court warriors who don't take 'games off'. This team lacks three things to get from good to great, 1) A true physical, take no prisoners big man in the middle; 2) A Coach who can either manage the difficult personalities or dump the pretenders; 3) Build a team around players like AI who's work ethic will be emulted, and not Carmelo, who will drag them down to his level of lazy, lazy play. Just watch the Celtics... quite simply the best hard working, well coached team on the court right now.
February 10, 2008
8:29 p.m.
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JimmyBoston writes:
This would be a disaster. Karl doesn't want him. He wanted Iverson and that worked out fine. We need to listen to George Karl. This would be a disaster for Denver.
www.nbaroto.com
February 10, 2008
8:49 p.m.
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moles3144 writes:
To Polego:
Its "fans" like you that are absolutely jokers. Prior to the last 2 games do you know what AI's shooting was? 25-74 since I assume you didn't. Wow that seems like team ball right there doesn't it? When they loose its all Anthony fault when they win he has nothing to do with it. Get a clue, AI gets a hall pass all the time while Anthony can never do anything right to people like you. But again I assume Anthony had nothing to do with the 14 wins to playoff team his rookie year right? And why is it one of the most respected coaches Coach K named him a captain and said he was the best player on the team? Figure it out.
February 10, 2008
9:03 p.m.
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queenjacyln writes:
Just because the LA media doesn't think the Nuggets are legit doesn't mean they are not relevant. Don't we all remember that the national media ignores all Denver teams? This is not an exception. Maybe spanking two playoff teams from the East this weekend, both telecast on ESPN, will help. We can only hope.
I am not opposed to making a deal but I wouldn't want to ruin our future chances. Kleiza has brought something special to the Nuggets and I'd hate to see him go for an expensive short term rental who has the capability of ruining the Nuggets team chemistry. Remember last year when people wrote articles upon articles about how Iverson wouldn't fit in and how it would take time for the Nuggets to gel and form chemistry? Well that time has finally come that the Nuggets are playing like a team and now we have to make a move just because everyone else is doing it?
Bottom line: make a deal if it makes sense, don't force the issue. Sometimes the best move you make is not making one.
February 10, 2008
10:03 p.m.
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den2mke writes:
All other things being equal there's only one number that matters: AI's assists. Was a pretty good team before the trade, pretty similar now. But look at the time's they've demonstrated they have a shot to be special--run at end of last season, last couple games, etc.--and AI's assists are 9-10 or greater. All the other parts are, in essence, there. But in order for the trade to really deliver to capabilities, AI can't cannibalize the offense. That simple. [ok, so a lick or two of defense wouldn't hurt either, but...]
Unfortunately, Karl doesn't seem to get this as Iverson seems to get the kid gloves treatment, but time will tell...
February 11, 2008
9:12 a.m.
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mark79trans writes:
The Nuggets need two things:
1. A point guard who can shoot, occasionally drive, and most importantly run the team. (should have kept Blake; too bad they had to trade Miller). Someone like Kidd or Cassell would completely change the Nuggets...they desperately need a conductor to run the team on the floor.
2. Nene back healthy or gone. The two power forwards on the Nuggets are a mess. Martin and Nene spend more time on the bench then on the floor...this is killing the team. If these two guys were healthy and played their best every night, the Nuggets would hardly ever loose.
* the last thing the Nuggets need is another small forward. Trading LK is completely stupid. Artest is another head case like Martin..why get him? They should offer up JR Smith and Martin...see if they can get a power forward or a point guard.
* if they can't deal Martin and/or get a "good" point guard, they should leave well enough alone.
February 11, 2008
11:05 a.m.
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misterbigge writes:
Polego makes good arguments moles, you should listen to him. Carmello is a great talent who has to learn team concept or he will end up as another Dominique Wilkens. Terrific highlights, no rings. There may be hope, Mello's rebounds are way up this year and there have been a (few) games where the team really moved the ball around and found the open shot. It looks like George either can't or won't say the 'd' word to his team. You know the 'd' word, it's what championship teams do when the other guys have the ball. Note to Stan: deal Kmart and Smith (the most talented loser in the league) and bring back Andre. That will immediately add 5-8 wins a year. Don't even think of moving Linas or Eduardo.
February 11, 2008
1:30 p.m.
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AllColoradoFan writes:
Many of you don't understand, nobody wants KMART and his bloated salary and even if they did we wouldn't get anything for him. You all sound like a Yankees fan that posted on ESPN awhile back that said that the Yankees should trade Pettite and Giambi for Johan Santana. That is absolutely absurd, nobody would make that trade. Only people who are caught up in hometown bias think that KMART has an value on the trade market. Now, if KMART plays well this season and plays well next season then maybe next trade deadline we can talk about trading him.
Also, I definitely agree with anyone who thinks we should get Cassell, but we should definitely not trade for Artest for all of the reasons stated above.
February 11, 2008
1:39 p.m.
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kmeissner writes:
Polego, you are an idiot.
I'm not sure if you've actually been "watching" games or just using the same old commentary from last year, but K-Mart has been a defensive weapon this year. He's close to being 100% and continues to improve every night.
And you say George is a problem? He's had a winning record since coming to Denver and we have hit the playoffs every year since he's been here.
The only point you made was that Melo isn't a team player and probably never will be. Although he is actually rebounding lately, he still jogs up and down the court while AI, Kleiza and Najera give 100% at all times.
February 11, 2008
4:43 p.m.
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basketballgirl writes:
I have watched every game this year and clearly some of you haven't.
Let's take a step back into history. Prior to Carmello coming to the Nuggets, we hadn't been in the playoff's in many years(lost track)and for anyone to say that his 25+ points a game doesn't contribute to the bottom line is crazy.
The AI and Melo combination along with George Karl is the best thing to Denver for a long time.
I would agree that we need a strong perimeter shooter, someone who can shoot from 3 point range but not at the expense of our top forward and guard.
We should keep Melo,Iverson, Camby, LK, Kenyon Martin but not sure about the others.
February 11, 2008
6:29 p.m.
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SR writes:
You have to give your core at least three years to make something happen. For example, look at teams that have won it all such as Detroit, San Antonio etc. They have kept their core around for quite a few years while the role players have changed around them. They also have/had some key glue players and specialists.
Denver's traditional core:
* Melo
* AI
* Camby
* K-Mart
* Nene
New up and coming:
* Kleiza
Glue/Specialists players:
* Najera
* Carter
* Diawara ?
Could be replaced for more glue/specialists:
* Wafer
* JR
* Hunter ?
* Atkins ?
February 12, 2008
12:12 a.m.
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randy7 writes:
I can't believe how harsh some of you are being on Melo. He has revived our organaztion and made us playoff contenders in a short time. Sure he is a young player with some growing up to do but people he is growing up in front of us every year. Also don't forget who the best player on the USA team was this summer. Coach K had nothing but great things to say about Melo's work ethic and competivness. Maybe he would play harder if he started to get the respect a player of his caliber deserves. I watch him game in and game out get hammered underneath with no calls. Calls that guys named Lebron and Coby would get at the drop of a dime. Maybe George should stop eating his candy and stick up for his young star. As far as the Nuggets go AI was a great move. With him and Melo they have a chance to beat anyone. The problem is that we gave K-Mart the worst contract ever. And now we can't even get rid of him at the blue light special. The Nuggs need to make some kind of move. Maybe a shooter to stretch the floor and help open the lane for Melo and AI. (a.k.a. Korver to Utah). Or I aggree a guy like Cassell a vet who can step up and hit big shots. Overall the West is loaded and come playoff time when the games matter I would hate to have to play the Nuggs.
February 12, 2008
12:46 p.m.
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Spider writes:
Thank you kmeissner. I get so tired on everyone ragging on Kenyon Martin all the time. The man had to have micro surgery on his knee. Do people think he was faking being hurt? Maybe it was a bad investment for the Nuggets because of the injuries, but that is no fault of the player. From what I see K-Mart seems to get along fine with the coach and his teammates. I see no discontent from him. What happened in the past seems to be water under the bridge between him and Karl. I've never heard of any off court activities that make him a bad person. And the healthier he gets the more he contributes to the team. GIVE THE GUY A BREAK!!
As far as the Nuggets in general? The only weak link to this team is J.R. Smith. I would like to se Karl give more of J.R.'s playing time to Wafer and Diawara. K-Mart's continued improvement on his health and the return of a healthy Nene would put this team over the top. The few faults that I see are mostly team issues i.e. thinking that they can turn it on or off whenever they want, they have shown that they can play very good "D" (when they want), they go streaks where they forget that their running style is their strenght and that the suck at the half court game and they sometimes dribble too much and pass too little.
February 12, 2008
1:52 p.m.
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aman writes:
For all you "Anthony hasn't matured" guys and AI is a warrior who plays every night, consider the playoffs last season. Anthony was the best player on the court for either team (Nene was not far behind). The only thing preventing a much more mature Anthony than we had seen in previous series from moving to the second round of the playoffs was Iverson.
By the way, after the series, Duncan said that it was one of the most physical series he had ever played in. But I am sure that Polego knows more about how physical Nene is than Tim Duncan would.
Shooting game by game in that series
Anthony
1: 10-18
2: 8-21
3: 10-21
4: 11-18
5: 8-20
Total: 47-98 48%
Iverson
1: 11-22
2: 9-25
3: 7-20
4: 9-25
5: 6-22
Total: 42-114 36%
The bigger the game gets, the more bad shots Iverson takes. We saw similar numbers last week against Utah when Anthony was 10-17 and Iverson was 9-27. This team will never be great unless it gets a point guard who can command the ball every time up, because in big games, Iverson takes way, way too many bad shots for his team to have a good chance to win. It worked okay when he played for a great defensive team back in the day with Philly, but the Nuggets are far from a great defensive team.
February 13, 2008
10:30 a.m.
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forrest_viv writes:
Last night's game was great road win. We need players to step up when our guns are off(AI and Melo). Kenyon was fantastic and continues to get back to what he used to be. JR showed what we all know he can be.
This team has had a fantastic year, especially when you consider the injuries and illnesses. Many critics and so-called fans think they should be better. I like where we're at(32-19)and how players' games have progressed(AC, Kenyon, Melo, etc.)
The fact that the Nuggets are given virtually no shot of doing anything in the rugged Western Conference is fine with me. I promise you that no team in the West wants to play us in the playoffs.
Critics will say we'll be lucky to even make the playoffs. Many will say the Nuggets are 1 game from not even making the playoffs(negative point of view). I say, we are only 4 games out of being the TOP seed in the West(positive point of view). Once again, this is despite injuries and illness.
Best case scenario: the Nuggets don't trade any players, and get healthier as we get closer to the playoffs
Tonight is a huge game. AI and/or Melo will go off tonight. Let's head into the break with another road win.
February 18, 2008
8:24 p.m.
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r8rh8r writes:
As is, the Nuggets are incapable of winning an NBA championship. You can't beat any of the elite teams in the west by relying on inefficient scorers like Melo and AI. Within their respective positions, Melo and AI are both ranked precisely 21st in the league in total shooting percentage (which factors in 3's and free throws). They accomplish this with a TS% of roughly 55% a piece. How do you expect to compete against front-court players like Bynum, Duncan, Stoudamire, Ginobilli, Nash, and Novitsky who--also as the featured scorers for their teams--shoot over 60% (some as high as 65%). Answer: play great defense and keep turnovers low. Guess what? This cast doesn't do that. The Nuggets are yielding the third most points per game in the league right now. I said this when they traded for AI and I'll say it again: no team is ever going to win an NBA championship with AI taking 30+ shots per game. Its impossible. I know he made a run when the eastern conference was about as deep as the D-league, but it won't happen in this conference with this much talent.
Lets enjoy the next couple of years with great talents like AI and Camby and hope that the Nuggets get their act together 2 or 3 years from now when Melo is peaking and some of these bloated superstar contracts are ready to leave town.