KRIEGER: Goodbye Shanahan, hello . . . Elway?
By Dave Krieger, Rocky Mountain News (Contact)
Tuesday, December 30, 2008
Do you agree with the Broncos' decision to fire coach Mike Shanahan?
When Pat Bowlen fired Dan Reeves as Broncos head coach following the 1992 season, it set the stage for the return of Mike Shanahan to the organization, although it took two years to happen.
When Bowlen fired Shanahan on Tuesday, it set the stage for the return of John Elway to the organization, and it could happen a lot sooner than Shanahan's did.
A couple of caveats:
First, this is based on no inside information, only my observation of the dynamics among these three men over the past several years.
Second, just how much responsibility Bowlen is ready to give Elway I'm not sure. They were partners, along with E. Stanley Kroenke, in ownership of the Colorado Crush of the Arena Football League, which recently suspended operations.
Elway had all the executive authority, so Bowlen has some experience dealing with him in that role. Elway has given no indication he wants to coach; quite the opposite. He has been preparing to be an NFL executive for some years now.
Two years ago, I asked him why he never exercised his option to buy a minority ownership interest in the team from Bowlen upon his retirement as a player. You'll recall that option caused Bowlen a bit of legal trouble with former Broncos owner Edgar Kaiser.
"To me, where the Broncos were and where I would have fit in, it wasn't the right fit at the time," Elway said then. "I think L.A. was going on around that time and I was talking to some groups out there. The timing wasn't right. I just always thought that at some point in time down the road I'd get another opportunity. And I still think I will."
That last line is suddenly looking prescient. It wasn't too hard to read between the lines of this explanation. With Shanahan in charge of everything football-related in Dove Valley, there was no substantive role for Elway. He could have had a ceremonial role as a minority owner, but he wasn't interested.
As an owner/executive in the AFL, I asked him if he still harbored ambitions of getting back into the NFL.
"Yeah, at some point in time," he said. "I just haven't had an opportunity up to this time. I think (about) that, especially as my kids grow up. I love the arena league, it's been a great experience, so if that doesn't come about, I'm thrilled and happy to be with the arena league. But I'd definitely look at some opportunities if they were to arise."
He probably didn't need the AFL to suspend operations to make the jump, but it doesn't hurt.
When I asked Shanahan two years ago about hiring Elway, he said the Hall-of-Fame quarterback was "too smart" to coach because of the hours and that a general manager or scout's job would also entail more hours than Elway probably wanted to devote to it.
What he didn't say was that Elway was interested in a meaningful executive position and Shanahan held all of those.
This may well have come up in discussions between Bowlen and Shanahan leading up to Shanahan's firing. It wouldn't surprise me if Bowlen offered Shanahan an opportunity to continue coaching under a new general manager and Shanahan, still mindful of the lesson he learned working for Al Davis, turned it down.
Whether Elway would be any good as an NFL executive is another question. He could certainly handle the public front man responsibilities, as he did ably for the Crush and, along with Jon Bon Jovi, the entire AFL.
Former AFL commissioner David Baker praised Elway's work on executive league committees as an owner, for whatever that's worth, and the Crush won an AFL championship in 2005.
Certainly, he would need some good NFL personnel people to support him. But hiring Elway in an executive role would probably eliminate the top tier of general manager candidates, people like New England's Scott Pioli, who are in a position to demand all executive authority.
It's also possible, I suppose, that Bowlen could bring Elway on as an apprentice to an experienced GM as director of football operations or something, although I'm not sure how attractive Elway would find a glorified scout's job.
An important byproduct of bringing him back into the organization would be to encourage more interaction between Elway and Jay Cutler.
There, too, Shanahan has been the impediment. He wanted his own people in Cutler's ear. Given the similarities between Elway's and Cutler's athletic gifts, their collaboration for the benefit of the Broncos seems like a no-brainer.
Mike Shanahan had a great run in Denver. He is as indelible a part of the back-to-back Super Bowl championships as Elway, Terrell Davis or anybody else. But, like Reeves, the man he fought, he demanded total control.
When his time came, it opened the door for the greatest Bronco of all time to rejoin the organization. Don't be surprised if Bowlen takes advantage.
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December 30, 2008
8:35 p.m.
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nmbronco1 writes:
Very interesting... I like this line:
"Given the similarities between Elway's and Cutler's athletic gifts, their collaboration for the benefit of the Broncos seems like a no-brainer."
I never did understand why there wasn't more interaction between these two guys. Cutler claims he has a better arm than Elway - really? Cutler also is elusive just as Elway was. Having John in the organization would make the blow of losing Shanahan a lot easier to handle. Maybe bring in Rod Smith too, along with John Lynch. Not Cowher or some of the other "around the block" coaches being named out there. A strong GM is a must. It'll be interesting to see how this all plays out...
December 30, 2008
8:53 p.m.
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baylinorcrush writes:
Other than the Colorado Crush, Elway has had no experience at all with any off the field position in the NFL. This is a nice story, I somehow fail to see the big upside to him becoming part of Bronco management or ownership, at least in the first few years.
December 30, 2008
9:08 p.m.
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jaybyrd writes:
Let's bag the man-crush routine re: Elway; he is not a coach and I do not see the NFL as a training ground for someone with no coaching experience. There are no doubt plenty of experienced and successful college and former pro coaches and GM's floating around; sign one of them, or reduce your ticket prices to reflect the chances of a team guided by an inexperienced former player.
December 30, 2008
9:31 p.m.
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gentrrm writes:
Not to comment on the Elway to be or not to be situation, but to rather comment on the "he is not a coach and I do not see the NFL as a training ground for someone with no coaching experience" comment. There are a number of former NFL players who have used the NFL as a training ground. Gary Kubiak comes to mine.
December 30, 2008
9:50 p.m.
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golffanatic777 writes:
This article shows why Dave Krieger needs to stay on in Denver, no matter what happens to the Rocky. This is insightful and commentary at its best. Kudos Dave .
December 30, 2008
10 p.m.
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jlstaud writes:
Come on people. This is just a newspaper guy trying to sell more papers. Elway will never rejoin the Broncos in any capacity. Nice thought, but it aint happening. Thanks for the great seasons John. Please don't tarnish your image by coming back and doing something you're not qualified to do.
December 30, 2008
10:04 p.m.
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Spider writes:
I don't think Elway wants the rigors of coaching. I do think he would want to and would be a good front office guy.
December 30, 2008
10:38 p.m.
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flybys writes:
Elway being associated with the Broncos is a romantic idea that could work well because of his love for the game and the franchise but it guarantees nothing.
Just an observation but Cutler has no desire to be coached by, mentored by or anything by Elway.
I like to ponder on Walden, like Dave Krieger, but I don't believe this story has legs. Whether it be coaching or ownership, I don't see it happening now. It's also not the cure to what ails the Broncos.
Luring a general manager with the skins on the wall should be priority 1A.
Then let him hire the coach he knows is the best fit.
http://coloradosn.blogspot.com/
December 30, 2008
10:56 p.m.
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giatime writes:
Enough with Elway already. The guy owns half of Denver. He is a greedy guy. best quaterback in Broncos history? Yes. Incredible Courage? yes. But enough already. How many millions does this guy need to milk Denver for? Now lets give him the broncos? Why dont we just all pledge our first born to his servitude?
December 30, 2008
11:54 p.m.
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craig1407levin writes:
To Mr. Krieger and the others,
Great story. Shanahan is gone and Elway in the wings so you say. Isn't this move promted by Miami's, Atlanta's, and other's success this year with new coaches? Please get to the real story as to why Shanahan was let go. I'm hearing reports on ESPN cited by this paper that Bowlen wanted the d. coordinator fired and he had to go but Coach said no so now Coach is fired. What's the deal? If it came down to a power play the owner usually always wins so no suprise. However, who is next in line? Bowlen will indeed raise season ticket prices next year which everyone will love. I used to take value in driving down with my son to watch Broncos football but it has lost the luster because of a poor home field atmosphere and a poor defense.
Finally, how many teams are going to fire their coaches tomorrow or in the coming weeks to land Coach. Hopefully, it's in the NFC.
And for those of you that want more vocal comments and leadership from Cutler, well he has already said that Bowlen made a bad mistake.
Wow! I think firing Coach by Bowlen trumps all failed fa acqusitions. This will come back to haunt Bronco Country.
I hope OU coach or maybe Carroll will be brought in. Maybe bring back Coyer and let J. Bates continue to run the O. One last thing to think about, when Coach goes, so does Bobby Turner, Dennison, and others. Not easy!
December 30, 2008
11:57 p.m.
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bobjohnson writes:
Why not Caroline Kennedy as coach and Elway as Senator from New York. Neither one has any qualifications but they both have enormous name recognition. I know, Elway never lived in New York, but then again, neither did what's-his-name's wife. Ms. Kennedy would follow in a long tradition of children of head coaches succeeding their fathers. Didn't Wade succeed Bum? How about the Moras, the Nolans, the Shulas? And wasn't JFK actually the biggest head coach of them all.
I know, Elway has no experience as a coach or senator. But that didn't stop our favorite action hero from becoming Governor of California, an Astronaut from becoming a senator from Ohio, an actor on the Love Boat from becoming a congressman from Pennsylvania, a hall of fame pitcher becoming a senator from Kentucky or Stuart Smalley, or whatever his name is from making a run as senator from Minnesota.
And if she is really good at her job, maybe we could move her down onto the field as a signal caller. I know, you say, she's fifty one. But she has no knee damage, probably pretty good mobility and brings incredible name recognition to the quarterback position.
December 31, 2008
12:12 a.m.
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rhsalas writes:
The blow of losing shanahan, oh please spare me.
If nubs1 thinks losing shanahan was a loss, i pity you.
he has screwed this team for years to come. who ever
takes over has their hands tied as per salary cap issues,
bad contracts, and a poisonous atmosphere he created
years ago. Or perhaps nubro1 does not remember
bubby? good move pat, should have done this 3 years
ago..
r salas
December 31, 2008
4:40 a.m.
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gwats writes:
Find a place for John Elway in the Broncos family and make it his home way from home. He could do Cutler a world of good.
Brilliant!
December 31, 2008
5:32 a.m.
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mrfxx writes:
Firing Shanahan left 2 vacancies:
GM - which Elway could probably fill admirably
Head coach - here's where I'm not so sure. The reason that Kubiak "made it" as a head coach without coming up thru the "traditional ranks" (whatever they are) is that he was a student of the game during his "backup years" (from what I saw of his playing, it appeared that, had Elway not been first string, Gary could have qualified), and became Shanny's right hand during those years - which is how he became offensive coordinator and finally qualified to become head coach.
Did Elway study the game as much? Would he have been qualified to become QB coach (as he did for his son's team) or eventually offensive coordinator? Is he willing to find a good offensive coordinator, a good defensive coordinator and a good special teams coach, then delegate the majority of his coaching decisions to them? Too many questions to answer to decide if Elway is head coach material - and too bad that Shanny insisted on being both head coach and GM. Perhaps if he had stuck to being head coach, he'd still have a job.
December 31, 2008
5:32 a.m.
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bgeist writes:
I have been a broncos fan way before Mike Shanahan and I will remain a fan long after. I don't like the decision but it was necessary in some ways. I am not against John taking on a GM role because he wants the Broncs to be winners and he loves this organization. I just want us to look at all the issues that need to be addressed and make the right decision for this city and team. Don't just hire people because they are the hot name. I am not against Cowher but I am not sold either. Gold Luck Pat. Big decisions ahead.
December 31, 2008
5:48 a.m.
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Winthrop writes:
When Elway retired, he should have become the Bronco QB coach. He then could have then moved up, the same way that Kubiak did.
To much water over the dam, for Elway to have any major role with the Broncos.
December 31, 2008
7:17 a.m.
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cptndunsel writes:
Elway return is great, but not at HC. We need an experienced winner in that role. Cowher would be my choice.
December 31, 2008
7:45 a.m.
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birddog writes:
Lets make Elway GM just so we can see if Cutler will still say he has a bigger arm than John Elway....Contract negotiations would be very interesting between John and Jay.
Jay definitly has a bigger mouth......
December 31, 2008
8:09 a.m.
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SparkyAFD writes:
Its a sad day and a new beginning in Broncoland.
Sorry to see Shanny go...Thanks for all you did Mike.
Now we will see if the bandwagon fans are happy with getting what they wanted. This is my first post, but I read all the posts every day...I am stuck in the frozen wastes of packerland...but bleed blue and orange. I took my lumps when we lost the SB in 1977, and will continue to defend my team to all comers.
CUTLER: has a big mouth? Do you not remember ELWAY and the things he said...or do you have CRS and only remember the good. It was amazing what shanny did with this team....reminds of the early ELWAY years when all we had was offense...and a bit of a running game and he will us to the SB....Cutler could probably do that too in the next year or two....but lets hope he never has to...those SB blow outs were devestating. We need DEFENSE...and shanny appeared to be out to prove he made good decisions (see webster), instead of making changes on the defensive front. Hopefully the new HC will be stronger in evaluating the talent, a good GM will trade, draft, sign a few quality defensive players, and we wont have 7 RB's on the IR next year. Very few bootlegs or rollouts in the last few games as there was no threat of a real running game. Bell was ok in the last game....but SD was playing the pass...and not that great against the run anyway. Cowher? not sure....would love to see Martz as OC, and a defensive minded HC. Special teams needs help too. We, the faithful, will continue to support our team in the next years....regardless of the outcome...maybe the bandwagon fans can climb in Shanny's moving truck...and go out of town with him....he can then leave them in Nebraska at a rest area, and they can watch the corn grow.
December 31, 2008
9:14 a.m.
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GOPteacher writes:
BobJohnson - I give your response a 10! That's hilarious.
December 31, 2008
9:26 a.m.
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BroncoRick69 writes:
Elway would not come in and coach. His primary responsibility would be evaluating talent. John Elways' dad did that for a number of years with the team. It's interesting, but probably wont happen.
December 31, 2008
9:27 a.m.
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ParkHillPosse writes:
I would absolutely dread the news that Elway is taking an executive role, either as Coach or GM. The track record of former star athletes is not good: look at Jordan, Larry Bird, Kevin McHale, Dan Marino's brief stint in Florida. Joe Dumars and Ozzie Newsome are a couple that have done well, but the general track record is exceptionally poor. These guys were star athletes, not talent scouts or coaches. Elway shouldn't be GM, Coach, Governor, Senator, Sports Commentator or Representative. Just because a guy can play QB doesn't mean he's disposed to success in another capacity.
December 31, 2008
9:35 a.m.
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Broncos101 writes:
Being in charge/owner of an AFL team does not mean you're ready to be the GM for an NFL team. I say bring in Pioli and let Elway work under him for a while if Bowlen is serious about bringing Elway in to the front office.
December 31, 2008
9:42 a.m.
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nando45 writes:
Come on, the idea of Elway filling a position in the Bronco organization in any capacity borders on crazy drinking talk, history has proven time and again that great players don't always make great GM's or coaches. Elway would be crazy to even consider any position, because to do so would set him up for alot of critics to come out and tarnish his image. So for all you diehard Bronco fans, put this crazy notion out of mind, go back to bed, for tomorrow will look better.
December 31, 2008
9:43 a.m.
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chartguy writes:
It's an interesting speculation, but I doubt it will come to pass.
I think the much more likely outcome is that Bob Stoops will get the job after OU plays its BCS game. Bowlen earned a business degree and then a law degree at OU. Stoops has done all he can in the college game. Bowlen would not have fired Shanahan without having his replacement in mind.
As great a quarterback as Elway was (and he was one of the best, ever), I have never gotten the impression that he's a good manager, or executive. His fame and popularity draws car buyers to dealerships or fans to games, but business and personnel decisions are not his strengths.
December 31, 2008
10:20 a.m.
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mootobaby writes:
Bob Stoops would be much preferable to Bill Cowher. Sooner rather than Steeler.
December 31, 2008
10:21 a.m.
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arvada_mark writes:
Elway is not a coach. He is a GM, however. If running the Crush is not experience, then what is? He'd do fine. He knows the game & he knows personel. Does he have more to learn? Yes. Could you stand to learn more about your own job? Probably. So, as long as he is interested, & there is not somebody else who is a better fit, then I say hire John. Apparently we can't win without him, so bring him back. And for that guy that suggested we give our 1st born to him, you're close. We do worship John as if he is a god. After Dale Earnhardt won his only Daytona 500 in '98, he cited John as his inpiration. He said that if John could still win a SB so far into his career, he felt he still could win the 500 at his age. Pioli or whatever his name is can't inspire people like that.
December 31, 2008
10:26 a.m.
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bassman writes:
It could be that Elway could pass along the lessons he learned later in his career to Cutler. Namely to be more careful with the ball and to take those check downs. It also could be that the pressure of having Elway be the QB's boss would be too much pressure. I think the latter is much more likely. Bring in Pioli.
December 31, 2008
10:28 a.m.
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cpspeaker writes:
Why would you bring Kubiak as a head coach? He hasn't been a good head coach! Gary made a great Quarterback coach and that's what Cutler needs!
We have to remember that Cutler is only in his third year. I'm not making excuses for him. Although, Cutler needs to step up and stop making poor decisions. For example, throwing to one wide-receiver and one tight-end!
As for the Defense, if anyone needs to be fired, it is defensive coordinator! Denver didn't have a pass rush or couldn't stop the run all year. now, I do blame Shanahan for this!
First, he hired a idiot who didn't believe in pressuring the quarterback. You're going to get beat every time.
Second, they couldn't stop the run! As, a fantasy player, when running-backs would play us. I made out like a bandit!
December 31, 2008
10:31 a.m.
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arvada_mark writes:
One more comment about the experience factor. If we all truly believed that only the experienced should get the job, then none of us would have ever had that 1st job...and, yes, Senator McCain would now be our President Elect.
December 31, 2008
12:02 p.m.
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MavrickG writes:
giatime another liberal hater who hates anyone who is successful.
Bring John on! I think he would be a great GM.
December 31, 2008
1:25 p.m.
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Colorado4ever writes:
It's going to be fun watching everything unfold whichever way things go and it's amazing how many bloggers have been chipping in with comments. It's an exciting time unless you're a car maker, retailer or stock broker I guess...
December 31, 2008
2:08 p.m.
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leavemealone writes:
Welcome back John!
December 31, 2008
2:09 p.m.
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TONE writes:
chartguy - 'His fame and popularity draws car buyers to dealerships or fans to games, but business and personnel decisions are not his strengths.'
This is where I think you are wrong. John is a good business man. If he wasn't all his business venture would have fail no matter how popular he is. He has the mind of a winner and you can see that happen with him taking over the Crush. From a business point of view, being around winners usually bring winning attitude and that translate to wanting to win also. His stature would demand alot from the players and their habit. Just like Jordan did with the Bulls, his stature demand all his team mates to play to his level. I'm sure you all can see the difference in that. Just look at how Kobe and Jordan different from eachothers. You don't see that in Kobe, but you sure can see that in Jordan.
December 31, 2008
2:10 p.m.
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TONE writes:
chartguy - 'His fame and popularity draws car buyers to dealerships or fans to games, but business and personnel decisions are not his strengths.'
This is where I think you are wrong. John is a good business man. If he wasn't all his business venture would have fail no matter how popular he is. He has the mind of a winner and you can see that happen with him taking over the Crush. From a business point of view, being around winners usually bring winning attitude and that translate to wanting to win also. His stature would demand alot from the players and their habit. Just like Jordan did with the Bulls, his stature demand all his team mates to play to his level. I'm sure you all can see the difference in that. Just look at how Kobe and Jordan different from eachothers. You don't see that in Kobe, but you sure can see that in Jordan.
December 31, 2008
2:25 p.m.
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okietrout writes:
I agree about all the talk about Elway not being HC but most of you are way off base about him as a GM. A good GM in the NFL has the ability to evaluate talent, negotiate with talent, and (most importantly) attract talent. Elway would need help from capable assistants in the evaluating part but he is, no I'm not crazy, better than anyone in the business (including current GM's) in being able to first attract the talent (if you don't believe me, watch NFL network or ESPN when Elway comes on- every NFL player worships Elway and respects him immensely) and then negotiate with them (think of the precedent that Elway set during the twilight of his career- placing personal contract $$$$ aside while putting the team and winning championships first). We have talent but we are missing the X factor of quality veteran leaders who want to help the team win a championship at any cost. Our 2 SB victories aren't attributed to young talent, instead it can be credited to veterans that wanted to win the big one (Romo, Eddie Mc, Mobley, Neil Smith, Alfred Williams, etc..). You've also got to take into account the reality that a rookie salary cap is coming and it will mean that vets are more sought after. There is no better man in pro football that can sell a team to a vet hungry for a ring. To me, this is a no-brainer. We'll fix the leadership problem and have a guy who knows what it takes to win by attracting the high quality players that we so desperately need.
December 31, 2008
7:24 p.m.
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can_am_broncofan writes:
i like the idea of bringing in former bronco players to coach. they know the team, the media,the city, they were former players themselves & should relate & work well with the young current players on this team."keep it in the family"
December 31, 2008
9:45 p.m.
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Hola writes:
No, No, No, No. Elway != Coach. Elway == steak salesman.
No. No. No...