Dad arrested after dispute over which gang right for baby
Mom tells police she, ex-boyfriend could not agree
By Bill Scanlon, Rocky Mountain News (Contact)
Thursday, April 10, 2008
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When Mom wears one set of gang colors and Dad wears another, conflict over how to raise the baby can cause irreconcilable differences.
At least that's what happened for one Commerce City couple.
Commerce City police were called to a disturbance Saturday at a Hollywood Video on East 64th Street, where a man reportedly was harassing his ex-girlfriend, who was working there.
The man knocked over a computer and a magazine stand and yelled obscenities at her, witnesses said.
He left the store before police arrived.
When officers questioned the woman, they learned that the two had been together for four years and were the parents of a child.
When police asked the woman why the two had separated, she said they have "different ideas about how the baby should be raised," according to a police report.
When officer Daniel Swift asked the woman what she meant by that, she said that the two belong to different street gangs.
"They could not agree on which gang the baby would claim," Swift said.
Joseph Manzanares, 19, was arrested later at his home.
He was taken to the Commerce City Police Department for processing and then transferred to the Adams County Jail, police said.
Manzanares pleaded guilty to disorderly conduct, and a harassment charge against him was dismissed.
He owes Adams County Courts $810 in court, processing and probation-supervision fees.
Manzanares wasn't available for comment.
scanlon@RockyMountainNews.com or 303-954-2897
April 10, 2008
6:03 a.m.
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Retread writes:
These kids these days, the kid will probably be a computer Geek...Whats a parent to do???
April 10, 2008
6:48 a.m.
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just_readin writes:
my gang, your gang. Boy that is a major decision. Guess that is the second question after what dope are we going to push today.
April 10, 2008
6:51 a.m.
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Why writes:
How about PINK or BABY BLUE?
April 10, 2008
6:51 a.m.
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Shaupeen writes:
Classic.
April 10, 2008
6:58 a.m.
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vudumom writes:
How about taking the child away from both the parents. How can either of them be fit parents if they are in gangs.Lets face it gangs are not selling cookies and having tea parties. I guess we are supposed to sit back and watch the child be raised by two morons that will be putting the child in danger.
How does Human Services think this is an safe enviroment to raise a child?
April 10, 2008
7:02 a.m.
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hdfresh writes:
Reminds me of Westside Story. We all have to make hard decisions in life for you kid as in where they go to school, what religion is appropriate, what side they claim..things like that.
April 10, 2008
7:18 a.m.
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Froward69 writes:
nope not about how to save for college, nor whether to put the child in public or charter school. but rather what colors to wear whilst committing crimes. Downward spiral at its best.
April 10, 2008
7:27 a.m.
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MarineGrunt writes:
And the hits just keep on coming...
Have to have a license to drive a car. Own a dog. Carry a weapon.
But any drug dealing banger can have a kid. Way to go, god.
April 10, 2008
7:29 a.m.
Houstongolfnut writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
April 10, 2008
7:33 a.m.
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pegasus99_aka_DR writes:
How about finding a "good" home for the kid, then taking mom and dad and putting them on a plane headed west, giving them parachutes, and pushing them out about half way between Alaska and Hawaii? That way, maybe the child joins NO GANG(which is an option you stupid people) and the parents don't get to procreate further and junk up the world any more with their ilk.
April 10, 2008
7:35 a.m.
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Scott writes:
And of course the Adams county social service losers won't pull the baby out of this scumbag environment. Psycho-Babblist, the second most worthless things on the face of the Earth.
While AdCo social (dis)services is at it, haul the two welfare spawn generators down to a veterinarian and get BOTH of them fixed.
Scott
April 10, 2008
7:41 a.m.
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Alive writes:
Hey, let's all pretend this lifestyle is not real. Isn't that the way it is for ANY group but WASPS?
The double standards that currently exist creates rifts that cause strife.
April 10, 2008
7:43 a.m.
Golden writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
April 10, 2008
7:50 a.m.
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GWBushwacked writes:
And it use to be I'm catholic, you are protestant...just what church to take the children....at least they had the Episcopal church. Maybe the parents can find a gang that is a happy medium between the two :-)
April 10, 2008
7:53 a.m.
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gr8fuldude writes:
Keep the kid, and put these two to sleep. Good to see that they have their priorities straight. Si Se Puede!
April 10, 2008
8 a.m.
Spencer writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
April 10, 2008
8:08 a.m.
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DeimosJB writes:
In the information age and the news-saturation that accompanies it, there are few pieces of news that still generate shock through the incomprehensible stupidity of the parties involved. This is one of them. Everyone involved deserves a gold star, except the child, who deserves a safe upbringing and hope for the future.
April 10, 2008
8:23 a.m.
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EZBakeOven writes:
I vote for the Serranos gang. Bad a$$ reputation, good networking possibilities in prison, etc.
April 10, 2008
8:34 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
Hey, none of you commented on the fact that the mother was honest when she told the cops what the argument was about. Doesn't that say something about the mother?
April 10, 2008
8:35 a.m.
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AWM writes:
With parents like that.. this baby dosen't have a chance. No wonder Commerce City has such a tarnished image!
April 10, 2008
8:37 a.m.
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Scott writes:
Heidi,
Maybe. She is either honest or REALLY dumb. I'll bank on the dumb since she is in a gang.
Scott
April 10, 2008
8:41 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
Scott,
I liked your veterinarian comment!
April 10, 2008
8:44 a.m.
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American100 writes:
Hmmmm More of that WONDERFUL culture.
April 10, 2008
8:46 a.m.
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Steph writes:
How much do you all want to bet that this isn't the last baby this couple is going to have?
April 10, 2008
8:46 a.m.
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Squatch writes:
They need to wipe these 2 out and give that kid to a decent family. These 2 jokers are exactly the kind of people that need to be euthenized.
April 10, 2008
8:48 a.m.
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American100 writes:
I like the vet comment too.
I grew up on a ranch and had to help castrate the cattle (we'd throw the oysters to the barn cats. They'd fight over them.)
I'll offer my assistance for free.
April 10, 2008
8:49 a.m.
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aztlan99 writes:
Makes me proud to be Latino. And we wonder how come we never get anywhere. Babosos!!
April 10, 2008
9:01 a.m.
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kathyM writes:
Wow. Maybe in a few years the kid will be the proud recipient of a Darwin Award.
April 10, 2008
9:11 a.m.
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FallyBerry writes:
Modern day Romeo and Juliet. Maybe they'll make a movie.
April 10, 2008
9:14 a.m.
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Jasin writes:
Hasn't anyone considered the baby might want to enter its own gang? Talk about awkward family reunions.
April 10, 2008
9:14 a.m.
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medina88 writes:
Why do some of you diss the kid? It's not his fault. Hopfully this child learns right from wrong and takes his own path in life.
American100...your not perfect and neither is your culture.
April 10, 2008
9:20 a.m.
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nativegirl writes:
Well...what parents haven't had THAT argument???
/S
April 10, 2008
9:21 a.m.
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American100 writes:
Medina88 -I don't belong to gangs, my kids don't belong to gangs. I work, I DON'T BURDEN American society, even though I'm hispanic and am an immigrant.
I pay my own bills, teach my kids right from wrong & thank GOD no problems so far with 2 teens.
I speak perfect, unaccented english even though starting kindergarten I didn't speak a word of english.
My culture beats the hell out of what I see in the Mexican culture that, even generations later choses to live in the gang lifestyle, promoting it to their babies. SICKENING.
Glad I can say I'm NOT Mexican.
April 10, 2008
9:21 a.m.
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El_Braino writes:
um -- okay where to start. Are these parents being stupid? YES. But look at their age! The dad's 19, and I'm guessing the mother is in her teens too. These kids having kids is a bigger issue than what is related in this story. I'm also guessing that the dad's not a first generation born here in this country and althought there's a few comments about mexicans in here (mostly by hispanics), i'm glad it's been kept to a minimum. Commerce City isn't the best place to live, but violence is everywhere. What makes Commerce City gangs any different than the "fight clubs" in Boulder? If this was two Boulder teens arguing over what fight club their hemp-diaper-wearing, tie-dye t-shirt styling baby belonged to, would it be in the paper? Don't forget, the news/media is the biggest demoralizer out there...
April 10, 2008
9:27 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
El_Braino,
If this happened in Boulder, it would most certainly be in the paper. And you would see 10 times the comments here so far.
btw, in the hispanic culture, I thought it was acceptable, if not encouraged, for kids to have kids.
April 10, 2008
9:28 a.m.
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American100 writes:
I will temper my last statement with this: I know plenty of good Mexican people, but see a serious lack of self governing regarding the behavior which they extend to the community and USA.
April 10, 2008
9:29 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
I should correct myself, the Mexican culture, not hispanic culture.
April 10, 2008
9:31 a.m.
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El_Braino writes:
Heidi,
stop the insults. Hispanics, white, black, whatever -- we all want the best for our kids. Are there a few bad apples in each group? Most definitely. But know that the real hispanics out there do want the best, not only for their kids, but for their grandkids and future generations. These idiots that give the hispanic population a bad name are a few of the bad ones. And most of the time, these idiots are only hispanic by last name, not by being involved in the hispanic culture.
April 10, 2008
9:39 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
I wasn't insulting anyone, just the two people in this article. I interpreted your Boulder comment as an insult, although I am not defending that stereotype. I do agree that there are bad apples in every group and commend anyone who is trying to make a good life for their family in a legal and moral way.
April 10, 2008
9:42 a.m.
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nayla34u writes:
Wow! That is so sad both parents are in street gangs and they want to baby to be apart of one to wow. These parents need parenting classes and serious help.
April 10, 2008
9:45 a.m.
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Kered writes:
Hmmm...I wonder what John Elway has to say about this?
April 10, 2008
9:49 a.m.
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Scott writes:
No nayla34u, these poor misunderstood hispanic gang bangers do NOT need government paid parenting classes. The "serious help" that this garbage needs is the inability to produce more kids! Also, the baby needs a loving and caring home, which totally rules out the poor misunderstood hispanic gang bangers.
Scott
April 10, 2008
9:50 a.m.
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El_Braino writes:
Heidi,
What I was trying to say was that the news picks these stories and really takes advantage of current situations. I'm sure there were dumb stories from all parts of Colorado; but I'd be hard pressed to find good stories reported by the media that involve Commerce City, Aurora, North, or West Denver. These two parents (and it's hard to call them parents when they're making decisions like this) are idiots. Plain and simple. Do they deserve all the criticism posted here? Definitely. But do we also have to look at their environment and opportunities to better not only themselves, but their families? Or are we just dismissing what they did because of their last names and the city they reside in?
April 10, 2008
9:50 a.m.
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mamma354 writes:
You can't become a crip foo! You gots ta be born a crip! Put the baby down at 5 points with a gak and see if he shoot some punk assed bloods or some knock kneed crips.
April 10, 2008
9:59 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
El_Braino,
I think most of these comments had to do with the fact that these parents are in gangs and are wanting that lifestyle for their child. And I think it's a reasonable assumption that they are in Latino gangs. I believe this was a good story to report because it gives us awareness of the promotion of gang membership at a very early age, as well as the notion that there is nothing wrong with it. I don't know what we can really do about it, though.
April 10, 2008
10:04 a.m.
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American100 writes:
El Braino - If these 2 losers were educated in the USA they've had opportunity to better themselves.
I've never seen another group as opportunistic as the Mexi's.
They were raised by people with the same lack of charactor as they are going to raise their 15 kids with. It's their arrogance that keeps them in the gutter.
Gutter trash is what gutter trash spawns.
5 years ago you wouldn't have seen the angry, disgusted comments about mexi's, but the illegal's have caused such an uproar with their arrogant,blood sucking behavior that is has made it hard on all Hispanics, not just mexi's.
Mexican leaders need to step up and encourage change in their communities, not expect American society to accept them as they are or pity them for their lack of "opportunity".
April 10, 2008
10:05 a.m.
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SKTR writes:
So this is what the end of civilization looks like.........
April 10, 2008
10:05 a.m.
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El_Braino writes:
Heidi,
Hopefully the parents grow up soon and realize that their life is not theirs anymore. When you become a parent, your life changes dramatically. I hope, for the child's sake, that they realize this sooner rather than later. It's time for a change.
April 10, 2008
10:12 a.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100;
Obviously you've lived the life of luxury. I was educated by the DPS system and it was BAD! I was in all of the AP classes and had to use text books from 1958 for our Ancient Civilization class! DPS is a joke. It didn't prepare me for college and I was in the top 10 in GPA. Commerce City schools are even worse. Have you ever stepped foot in a Commerce City school? You'd see why these kids don't believe they have a future when there educational institute looks like prison.
And as far as opportunities, we all have opportunities in life. Some social classes have a lot better and more frequent opportunities than others. You can't look at your own upbringing and your own opportunities and think that all of us have that same privilege. We don't.
Your words spawn hate. And if that's what your looking to promote, then this is my last comment here. I'd rather give the Mexican community a blog that they can be proud of, and not feed into your hate messages.
April 10, 2008
10:22 a.m.
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American100 writes:
My life of luxury started with my being born in a prison where my Mother was being held by Castro. She died there. My Dad was in another prison camp.
My family was granted political assilym when I was 3.
We landed in NY, homeless, penniless & hungry, so my Dad asked a local grocer if we could ALL work stocking shelves in exchange for food and a place to sleep on the floor.
My Dad worked 3 jobs and yet managed to keep us together, in line and educated.
He married a wonderful woman who also contributed by working 2 jobs, all so we could live n a 3 room hovel.
I paid my own way through college with the help of a small baseball scholarship. I also won a power lifting stippend. Nobody ever gave me or mine anything.
My dad now builds about 200 homes a year in Miami, which skunks my construction company that builds 20-25 a year. Hard work, no crying or feeling self pity.
So BOO HOOHOO to these cry babies who think they have it so rough.
April 10, 2008
10:29 a.m.
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olsonmt writes:
Hmmm... for some reason I was not surprised to see the hispanic surname. Anyone else? El_Braino says we have to look at their environment. I don't blame the US. I don't blame Commerce City. This country will help those that want to help themselves. I blame the small but persistent segments of the hispanic and black communities that can't rise above their gang culture. Raising their kids to be gang bangers from birth is proof that these people willingly perpetuate gang culture. They deserve the misery, lack or opportunity, and death that comes with it. It's too bad some real "Americans" (legal or not, minority or not) get caught in the crossfire.
April 10, 2008
10:30 a.m.
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davies writes:
Heidi and El Braino: I do not see any mention of the mother's surname or any other indication that she is Latino/Hispanic/Mexican. In fact I think her gang could be the Aryan brotherhood.
But in any case, why don't the parents just shoot it out like true gangbangers?
April 10, 2008
10:36 a.m.
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blondiearvada writes:
American100, you seem very proud of who you are and how far you have come in this country. You should be. If EVERYONE had to fight as hard as your family has had to, then maybe more would be as appreciative of their life as you are of yours.
April 10, 2008
10:38 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
davies, good catch! How shallow of me to assume. She will not be going to Valhalla regardless of what gang she is in.
April 10, 2008
10:40 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
olsonmt,
I second that thought!!
April 10, 2008
10:41 a.m.
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American100 writes:
thanks blondiearvada.
I have NO respect for what I see coming across the border.
April 10, 2008
10:42 a.m.
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American100 writes:
By the way - My wife I would gladly adopt this beautiful, innocent baby.
April 10, 2008
10:44 a.m.
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olsonmt writes:
Schools are only as bad as the parents and the students make them. New textbooks and new buildings are not critical success factors. I've personally seen schools in other countries with dirt floors and a single textbook, but where there is a passion for learning. These kids make the most of their scant opportunities. El Branio, I'm sorry you complain about the eduction you got here. The parents in DPS need a wake up call. Think about rural schools for a minute... most have lower budgets, older buildings, etc. They don't have the same problems DPS does. The difference is they have students, parents and teachers that care.
April 10, 2008
10:45 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
American100,
Too bad you can't.
April 10, 2008
10:49 a.m.
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American100 writes:
Heidi that's the nicest thing anyone has said to me in a long time (on these posts).
Thanks
April 10, 2008
10:52 a.m.
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davies writes:
I had to look up 'Valhalla' awhile back to see what the *&%# it was. Seems to be some kind of afterlife place for the souls of warriors who died in battle. So maybe there WILL be some gangbangers there ;-)
April 10, 2008
10:54 a.m.
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Scott writes:
America100: Your story is what this country is all about! My hat is off to you and your entire family. Your cojones are a whole lot bigger than mine. ;-)
Too many times we forget that this country was built by people like America100 and his family. This is what makes America great. Instead all we hear about in the news is the scum like the two bags of filth that are fighting over which gang junior will be in.
Scott
April 10, 2008
10:55 a.m.
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olsonmt writes:
Davies, I will bet my life savings that the mom is a member of a Hispanic gang. As an aside, look up crime stats and count the numbers committed by black and hispanic gangs versus the Aryan Brotherhood or any other gang (including Asian, White et.al.). In the past, most every race and ethinicity has had a gang problem at one time or another. Whites have other problems today e.g. most serial killers, mall and school shooters, bombers, etc. The fact is today gangs are predominately a black and hispanic problem. Deal with it.
April 10, 2008
10:56 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
American100,
I hope you didn't take that as a sarcastic remark. I meant that I believe you could and would give that baby a much better life than it will probably have.
April 10, 2008
10:57 a.m.
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studog writes:
This is a very easy decision. The gang with the best 401k plan and the best health insurance should be the gang this kid should join. Come on people...use some common sense. Do I have to solve all of the worlds problems.
April 10, 2008
11 a.m.
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GWM writes:
Just be careful the child's rights are not infringed. He/she should be free to join any gang of choice.
April 10, 2008
11:04 a.m.
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davies writes:
olsonmt: Betting my life savings wouldn't be a big risk for me, due to ahem, a recent change in marital status. But my post was intended to be mostly tongue in cheek.
Interesting "whites have other problems" contention anyway; could start a whole new thread with that one.
April 10, 2008
11:04 a.m.
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blondiearvada writes:
If those who crossed the borders, and filled the boats were more like the family of American100 and most of our ancestors, there would not be the immigrant issues that we deal with today. Maybe he and his wife would consider adopting children to help them have the quality of life that they have woked so hard to achieve.
April 10, 2008
11:08 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
davies, should I lock the gates to Valhalla when your ex arrives?
April 10, 2008
11:08 a.m.
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American100 writes:
Thanks Heidi & Scott. No, I didn't detect any sarcasim.
People here probably think I'm a tyrant.
In real life I'm known to be VERY quiet & laid back, even shy & straight laced. I've never tried drugs or pot and I just started drinking 2 years ago. I just turned 41 so a little behind the curve. Love that friday night glass of wine.
My wife says I'm sensitive about the illegal thing because of my own hard background. She might be right.
I really do hate to see any baby who doesn't have 2 good parents. Very sad.
April 10, 2008
11:10 a.m.
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American100 writes:
and blondirarvda thx
April 10, 2008
11:13 a.m.
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olsonmt writes:
Sorry, Davies. I see the tounge firmly planted in your cheek now. My beef's not with you.
April 10, 2008
11:17 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
American100,
Looking back to when I was a rebellious teenager, I wonder if I would be where I am now if it wasn't for the great opportunities that were provided to me by my parents and heritage. I may have had a little bit later start to success in my life. You must have been a very strong person.
April 10, 2008
11:18 a.m.
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T1anda writes:
UGH!! In addition to the inbred stupidity they both received at birth. These two Trogladyte breeders should have definately been sterilized when they entered this world....along with millions of other idiots that birth babies like guppies.
April 10, 2008
11:19 a.m.
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my3pugs writes:
Gangs are a method to maximize short term economic prosperity. Assuming survival, long term prosperity either in prison or the gang is relatively better than the individual could likely attain given the education and abilities that the individual possesses. Gangs promise a better life for their members than the recruits expect. It may be that the promise is overstated or the expectations outside the gang are underappreciated, to the recruits the choice is clear even if to outsiders it appears insane. In this context, these parents only want what is best for their child, each perceives the gang of choice to be the best opportunity. Do parents have the right to make choices for their children as they see fit? Or are they subject to outside audit, review and reversal?
April 10, 2008
11:23 a.m.
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Gene writes:
They may be stupid, but I'll bet they have never voted for a Republican.
April 10, 2008
11:24 a.m.
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Ztliano writes:
This is why people from different gangs should not date.
April 10, 2008
11:25 a.m.
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MrCrush writes:
T1anda: You're right on the mark. Thanks for saying what really needs to be said. As long as this culture provides entitlements and incentives for ignorance to sustain itself, this will be the result.
April 10, 2008
11:25 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
my3pugs,
Something tells me you are a gang recruiter.
April 10, 2008
11:25 a.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100,
To say that you have no respect for what's coming across the border is a little harsh. Like I've said before, I'm guessing these parents aren't new or even first generation immigrants. And to lump them in with immigrants is a little stereotypical. I admit I jumped the gun and assumed that the mother is hispanic. My bad.
Your upbringing seems to define who you are today. But also, like I said before, the opportunities that you had, or your dad had, are not avaiable to everyone. Your dad was given the opportunity to leave a bad situation. He made the most of that and I solute him for his willingness to survive.
I agree, a student will learn in any environment. I learned in mine. But its hard to be proud of a school that seemed to not be proud of their students.
Its time for a change in our system. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The middle class is dying slowly and we're getting caught in a blame game. Blame the illegals, blame the Mexicans, blame all immigrants! What about blaming our financial institutes that promised $200,000 mortages for less than $1000 a month? Or manufacturing companies that moved oversees? Customer Service companies that moved to India? We're left fighting for construction jobs and cleaning jobs, while the real issue is over the jobs leaving this country...
April 10, 2008
11:26 a.m.
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beentheredonethat writes:
Maybe when the US population figures out why gangs exist, something will change, but right now our collective heads are in the sand. Drugs and prostitution are illegal, so they keep the shadow life lucrative. Adulthood rituals are thought to be only for so-called primitive cultures and religious minorities like the Jews, so boys and girls respond to that innate urge to prove themselves by doing profoundly unproductive things, including bringing babies into hopeless situations and fighting and killing people to gain status and respect from their "brotherhood." Notice: not too many Jewish kids bang in gangs-- ever wonder why? But even wealthy kids without clear paths to manhood form very destructive groupings (fight clubs, Neo-Nazis, Harris & Klebold) because that urge to prove one's virility is genuine and we HAVE NO CULTURALLY ACCEPTED RITUAL(S) in this country to fulfill it.
April 10, 2008
11:26 a.m.
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Heidi writes:
Zeteliano, do you honestly believe that they ever actually went out on a date?
April 10, 2008
11:32 a.m.
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American100 writes:
Actually, we really had a hard first few married years. Married young, parents young. Looking under cushions for diaper money. Losing it in Hurricane Andrew. We just started living comfortably about 5 years ago.
These are the very things that made us strong and the things that forged my strong opinion against cultural laziness. I know there are good and bad in all cultures. I have a step brother that is on the other end of life who had the same upbringing I had.
Just when we see way too much of this in a particular group, you have to throw political correctness out the window and try some COMMON SENSE.
April 10, 2008
11:41 a.m.
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davies writes:
Heidi, you can let my ex into Valhalla if she qualifies. If you happen to be a person of authority there, you can make her the official snake exterminator or something. Thanks.
April 10, 2008
11:48 a.m.
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ariel writes:
speaking as a jew, everyone knows that these things are determined via matrilineal descent. therefore, if mama is a crip, baby is a crip. Q.E.D.
April 10, 2008
11:50 a.m.
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jjez writes:
Hey, give the Mom a break! At least she has a job!
April 10, 2008
11:56 a.m.
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davies writes:
my3pugs: "Do parents have the right to make choices for their children as they see fit? Or are they subject to outside audit, review and reversal?"
There are many valid parental rights of course, but these should not automatically trump societal standards and the rights of the child. I would not mind if the social services pendulum swung away from parental rights and more towards children's rights. This would include measured but clear, definite, prompt consequences for parental failure, including permanent dissolution of legal guardianship. A parent admitting membership in a street gang would be strike one.
April 10, 2008
noon
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Crub writes:
You people are dumb.
April 10, 2008
12:06 p.m.
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jjez writes:
Hey davies--did you not notice that it's the afterlife for VIKING warriors? So unless you or your ex are from Minnesota, you wouldn't qualify! (okay, the MN thing is a joke but not the Viking part). As to the schools thing, they look like prisons in response to the fact that most of the attendees carry guns, knives & weapons of various sorts. And in doing so, should probably BE in prison. The schools are what the society makes them. And school pride is created by those who attend the school. If they spray paint gang symbols on the walls & fight in the halls, smash windows, destroy books etc, it's their own fault that they don't have a school to have pride in.
April 10, 2008
12:13 p.m.
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jjez writes:
El Brainio: "the opportunities that you had..are not avaiable to everyone" EXCUSE ME? opportunities are what you make of them! These kids have the opportunity to attend school, do well at it, get scholarships and/or student loans and get a higher education. They have plenty of opportunities to better themselves. They just don't take it. Learn to speak well, write well, and dress like a normal person (not with the crotch of your jeans down around your knees) and you'd be surprised what kind of opportunities present themselves!
April 10, 2008
12:16 p.m.
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say_what writes:
Really the colors you wear are pointless. The real question is which cell block will the baby have when he gets popped at 16 for killing someone?
April 10, 2008
12:23 p.m.
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medina88 writes:
American100-I am also hispanic NOT of Mexican heritage. I, like you, have wonderful well behaved boys (what a blessing) I work and do the american thing. I just think it's wrong to judge and blame the mexican's. How do you know these parent are from Mexico? You don't, so don't diss without the facts. So...your culture has NEVER broken the law and NO ONE is part of ANY type of gang? wow, you should tell us your race so we can pull a few things. Sure you had a rough childhood, most of us have. Get over it and be glad where you are now. Why not give others the benefit of the doubt and allow them a chance to succeed. some do and some don't.
I'm not thrilled that we have a ton of aliens here but we can't blame the whole hispanic/latino culture because a few bad ones come over. We can't even assume every one in the paper is from Mexico. We raise our children the best we can. Those parent who don't....they are who we blame.
El_Braino...great comments on the hispanic cultures.
April 10, 2008
12:24 p.m.
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davies writes:
Crub: No we're not, you are.
April 10, 2008
12:24 p.m.
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RickyLee writes:
They sound like such fine upstanding citizens....or not.
April 10, 2008
12:33 p.m.
fefe writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
April 10, 2008
12:33 p.m.
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dirkle writes:
" life in the low lane ... "
April 10, 2008
12:37 p.m.
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OhBrother writes:
Just becuase you make a mistake in your life @ 19 doesn't automaticly make you a failure. I did plently of stupid things but I learned from them. I agree there is a limit and exscuses can never replace action but to condem children won't resolve this problem.
Be proud of your upbringing and your achomplishments. Everyone has an oportunity to better themselves in this country but every person does not obtain an inner strength or self confidence to rise above difficult circumstances. It's easy to go down the wrong path when you don't have a support team and your ideas of success are what you see on telivison and internet. This isn't a sad or sob story. it's a product of society and poor parental guidence
April 10, 2008
12:37 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
fefe,
Read American100's posts before you go spouting off! Who's the bigot? Just because his name is American100, you assume he is white.
April 10, 2008
12:46 p.m.
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coloradolifer writes:
I'm waiting for Tina Griego's take on this...
April 10, 2008
1:04 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Heidi what we just saw from fefe is the anti-american rhetoric, the blame whitey mentality that holds people back.
Fefe is angry because I don't support and condone gangs or lazy lifestyles and people expecting handouts.
As for a wantabe, wantabe what?
I have a great family, kids, successful business, beautiful home. I have what I want and I did it without becoming A BURDEN TO SOCIETY.
April 10, 2008
1:11 p.m.
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ISKIFREELY writes:
Don't you people have jobs?
April 10, 2008
1:13 p.m.
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American100 writes:
It's fun to watch people go nuts about my comments.
Because I am pro-American people assume I'm white.
There are lots of proud brown, black, yellow and red Americans too.
Don't assume someone is white just because they're right.
April 10, 2008
1:21 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100;
You talk about the blame whitey mentality, but you also talk about how you're glad you're not Mexican. You even went so far as to say -- more of that WONDERFUL culture. You talk about how you haven't seen anything good cross the border, but you yourself crossed the border (and yes, the ocean is a border). It's hard to believe that you are quiet and laid back - as you have posted - when all you do is hate bait on this blog. And have you ever considered the posibility that these parent could be of Cuban descent?
April 10, 2008
1:24 p.m.
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davies writes:
Yes El Braino, I think he has. I think his point is it's not where you come from, it's how you act and what you do.
April 10, 2008
1:26 p.m.
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American100 writes:
ElBraino - If it turns our either of these losers are of Cuban descent, I will buy you a beer.
By the way, if you look back you'll notice I said:
I know there are good and bad in all cultures. I have a step brother that is on the other end of life who had the same upbringing I had.
Just when we see way too much of this in a particular group, you have to throw political correctness out the window and try some COMMON SENSE.
April 10, 2008
1:28 p.m.
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davies writes:
I stand corrected.
April 10, 2008
1:28 p.m.
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American100 writes:
AND we came here legally. That's a HUGE part of assimilating.
April 10, 2008
1:29 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Stand corrected Davies?
April 10, 2008
1:30 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
I've read your blogs. But look at your last blog - "Just when we see way too much of this in a particular group, you have to throw political correctness out the window and try some COMMON SENSE." - are you saying Mexicans or are you saying hispanics altogether? What it looks like to me is you are Mexican-bashing, and that's the way I've interpreted your comments.
April 10, 2008
1:30 p.m.
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buffsblg writes:
Classic discussion on here. No real way to actually know either parents race. I did child protection in Aurora and learned that names do not always reflect racial background. Certainly could be hispanic, but there are also "black" gangs and "asian" gangs in that area. Lets not all over generalize except to say these may not be the greatest parents.
I have no inside info on this case, but my experience with Adams DHS is that they keep pretty quiet about investigations. The fact that it is not in the paper does not mean that there is not an investigation.
April 10, 2008
1:33 p.m.
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CaptainObvious writes:
Why would anyone want to help these people? It's a very bad investment. Sure, we could pour money into a program to help them, but once they embrace the street-gang lifestyle and its "Here Today, Gone Tomorrow" mentality, they are living on borrowed time. Statistically, it's only a (short) matter of time before their dead or in prison. Why waste the money? They made their choice, let'em live (and die) with it.
April 10, 2008
1:36 p.m.
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anthony1979 writes:
This is horrible and disgusting. This is also ANOTHER example of how bad our child welfare services are. The kid, unfortunately, will probably end up not being a productive, positive part of society. It's sad to see a child born into such a disadvantage but it happens all the time, even worse situations.
Joseph Manzanares, toast to you!!...you completely clueless idiot!...maybe the kid will luck out and BOTH of the parents will die in some sort of gang activity. I must also say SHAME ON THE BABY'S GRANDPARENTS! These idiots are just teenagers, not that it is a good excuse but it is a factor. There should be SOMEONE telling these kids SOMETHING!
Not all teenage Latino/Chicano/Hispanics are like this but unfortunately, they are the stereotypical ones....thanks guys for helping us continually look bad!!
April 10, 2008
1:38 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Mexicans are where we are seeing enormous problems.
Which other group, hispanic or otherwise has created as much outrage across America with illegals & crime?
April 10, 2008
1:43 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
So you're saying that all/majority of Cubans are outstanding citizens and all have come here legally?
You generalize so much. Just because the last name is hispanic, you lump them all with illegal Mexicans. Who's being stereotypical?
April 10, 2008
1:44 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Bottom line El Braino - the constant stream of crime and bad press about Mexicans, legal and not gives all Hispanics a black eye.
There's no excuse for mass bad behavior. It's a cultural issue, not a racial issue.
It's about being an American, not being white, black or brown.
April 10, 2008
1:51 p.m.
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American100 writes:
I know Jeuden - I'm a firm believer the USA would be an ugly extension of Mexico if white settlers hadn't come along and turned America into the beautiful, gracious place it is.
I think other cultures could have done it too but I don't think Mexicans would be any better off than they are now, probably worse off, if somebody else hadn't come in to settle the country.
April 10, 2008
1:56 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100;
You've stated that you are raising kids. Hopefully they become as successful as you claim you are. But if your kids were to ever become news, they'd be lumped together with the rest of us unlawful, illegal Mexicans. Newspapers don't print ancestry documents...
April 10, 2008
1:58 p.m.
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American100 writes:
My point exactly El Braino.
Mexicans are giving ALL hispanics a black eye.
April 10, 2008
1:59 p.m.
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davies writes:
Jeuden is like that old Senator Hayakawa of California, who said about the Panama Canal: "I think we should keep it. We stole it fair and square".
April 10, 2008
2 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
No American100;
The assumption of ancestry, race, and heritage is giving Mexicans a black eye.
April 10, 2008
2:02 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Oh Bull
April 10, 2008
2:02 p.m.
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ashlandbus writes:
American100... I would say groups that have created as much outrage are drug dealers, drug addicts, theives, gangsters, violent individuals, wife beaters, drunk drivers, etc. What do you think? These are actual criminals. Not the "Hispanic" group you speak of. The "Hispanic" group (leag or otherwise) I know as my neighbors are mostly wonderful people. They don't cause me any harm or trouble.
April 10, 2008
2:03 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
Is it? How many out there are assuming that these parents are Mexican?
April 10, 2008
2:05 p.m.
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American100 writes:
why do you think that is El Braino?
April 10, 2008
2:10 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
We live so close to Mexico that anyone with a hispanic last name is automatically Mexican. If we were in New York, we'd be Puerto Rican. Miami? Cuban. Pennsylvania? Brazilian.
But beyond that, even if these parents were Mexican, the choices that they made were their choices, not that of a race. Responsibility lies at the individual level. We all want what's best for our kids. We can give them all the tools to succeed. But even kids make their own choices. Look at your brother compared to you. We all have bad seeds in our families. I'm not immune to that. But do we love them less? Do we let them define our family character? No.
April 10, 2008
2:17 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
I think we should give the Panama Canal to the descendants of Attila the Hun.
April 10, 2008
2:26 p.m.
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davies writes:
I'm ambivalent. No I don't think we should give American territory back. But I don't think we should say it is BS that we stole it from Mexico or the natives or whoever either. We probably did steal it just as fair and square as any other territory holder on the planet.
Some might say the whole illegal immigrant debate is another example of this.
April 10, 2008
2:28 p.m.
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American100 writes:
We've given them the tools they need to succeed. They need to go back to Mexico now and make it a place worth living.
April 10, 2008
2:29 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100 -- again, you're Mexican bashing! It's shamefull that you have to go back to that tactic. Your blogs seem educated, but then your ignorance shows.
April 10, 2008
2:32 p.m.
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American100 writes:
what did fefe say that got him deleted
April 10, 2008
2:33 p.m.
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davies writes:
You sound like one of those evil conspirators that want to enslave the world.
April 10, 2008
2:36 p.m.
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American100 writes:
I liked Mexicans more when I was ignorant about Mexi's
April 10, 2008
2:36 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
*poof* Gone is fefe! He was bashing American100, calling him a bigot, thinking he is almighty whitey.
April 10, 2008
2:37 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100, your ignorance has increased...
April 10, 2008
2:38 p.m.
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American100 writes:
It's the illegals that made me start noticing the Mexi mind set
April 10, 2008
2:41 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100,
why so angry towards Mexicans? You've assumed so much in your blogs. And what exactly is the Mexi mind set?
April 10, 2008
2:44 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
It was the Mexican strike day and the burning of the flag, and the hanging upside down of the American flag with the Mexican flag flying over it that really got me going!
April 10, 2008
2:47 p.m.
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davies writes:
Jeuden, I was wondering if you were coming 'out' today or not. Let's see if Am100 shuns you now.
April 10, 2008
2:48 p.m.
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American100 writes:
America owes us, Americans owe us, blame whites for our failures, blame whites for our childrens failures, it's your fault our kids are on drugs and in gangs, you stole america from us, you're bad, we are victims, we don't have to learn english, even generations later we sound like we just crossed the border, we're entitled to be here illegally and you have to feed, clothe,educate and medicate us etc etc etc
April 10, 2008
2:50 p.m.
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American100 writes:
I only shun lazy criminals & beggars
April 10, 2008
2:53 p.m.
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davies writes:
Am100: Not Jews then, who are generally acknowledged to be hard workers?
April 10, 2008
2:53 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
Wow, and this is the same person who wrote this:
--In real life I'm known to be VERY quiet & laid back, even shy & straight laced. I've never tried drugs or pot and I just started drinking 2 years ago. I just turned 41 so a little behind the curve. Love that friday night glass of wine. My wife says I'm sensitive about the illegal thing because of my own hard background. She might be right.--
I hope you don't own a gun because I'm thinking that might not be a good thing Dr. Jekyll.
April 10, 2008
2:55 p.m.
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GWM writes:
American100, is that you jdub?
April 10, 2008
2:58 p.m.
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American100 writes:
El Braino - I'm not violent but the culture in question is. Isn't that why they claim to flee in fear?
April 10, 2008
2:59 p.m.
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Gemini79 writes:
There's nothing like the discussion of Race that gets everyone's panties in a bunch.
Trash does come in all colors...
April 10, 2008
3 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Nope I'm not jdub
April 10, 2008
3:03 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
Whatever happened to him?
April 10, 2008
3:04 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
Again, you're assuming that all the criminals in these stories with hispanic last names are Mexican. All I've tried to point out is that it might not be that way. You've clearly had issues with Mexicans before, and I'm sorry to hear that. But bloging stereotypes and hate messages doesn't solve problems; it only feeds into the notion that all hispanics are monsters.
April 10, 2008
3:04 p.m.
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Why writes:
*Wondering* What kind of soap American100 uses to turn his brown skin white?
April 10, 2008
3:05 p.m.
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American100 writes:
Got a problem with hard working, successful hispanic immigrants WHY?
April 10, 2008
3:12 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
This story is on the Denver Post. The dad is hispanic (don't know nationality) and the mother is African-American...
http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnew...
April 10, 2008
3:12 p.m.
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American100 writes:
WHY your comment suggests whites are the only ones who oppose the mexi crime spree, gangs and illegals
April 10, 2008
3:15 p.m.
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happymike44 writes:
Let me start by saying the reason we have guns in the school is the parents fault.First they do not feel they owe anything to anybody.They are the ones who are cuasing the problem by not making it clear to their kids that they will not tolerate any nonsense.Also let's start putting the parents of these little bundles of joy in prison.FInd a gun on your kid you go to jail,Find a knofe you go to jail,find anyting that kids are not supposed to be carrying you go to jail.But here is the twist make them work all week long at their job.Then put them in jail on the weekends.This means no time off and I bet the thought of spending all your free time in jail will bring all these problems to a halt.But even if your working all the time.Then you go to jail when you get off work.The answer is this your kid carries a gun you go to jail for every free minute of you life.So how hard is that to understand.Wonder how fast all the mommy and daddy of these little sweeties would put up with the guns and knife routine.Also lets start deporting the ones we can,then maybe if we make it clear you are a criminal and we don't and won't tolerate this kind of behavior.Then maybe we can clean up the garbage and send it back where it came from.
April 10, 2008
3:18 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
happymike,
So who is going to watch over and take care of the little bundles of joy when the parents are in jail?
April 10, 2008
3:20 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
At the end of the day, its a tragedy that a child should have to be born into such a bad situation. Can we change the world? Yes we can. Si se puede. But it starts with all of us. It starts with the realization that we are all at fault -- not just for gangs, but for how we treat each other.
"We have learned to fly the air like birds and swim the sea like fish, but we have not learned the simple art of living together as brothers." ~Martin Luther King, Jr., Strength to Love, 1963
April 10, 2008
3:29 p.m.
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Squatch writes:
Holy Crap Criminals do come in other shades of color than Brown & Black.
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news...
April 10, 2008
3:30 p.m.
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Appalachian writes:
My wife sent this article to me and it reminded me of why we decided to live in Colorado - the people! Seriously some of the funniest comments I have EVER read (love the Westside Story one).
American100, you are my hero. It's people like you who make me proud to call this nation my home. As for the bigots who gone on and on about Blacks v. Hispanics, etc., there is a special place in hell reserved for a man who fails to reach out to other men, regardless of the color of their hands.
As for the baby, each one: cut it in half and let each gang have their share. Duh...
April 10, 2008
3:32 p.m.
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davies writes:
You mean Jeuden is not jdub? Or is this some kind of disinformation campaign?
April 10, 2008
3:34 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
Wow, Appalachian,
You want people who fail to reach out to other men to go to hell, but you are encouraging gang members to cut a baby in half? Where did you come from?
Oh, and welcome to RMN.
April 10, 2008
3:35 p.m.
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American100 writes:
El Braino - It's sure as HELL not my fault this crap goes on.
You can take blame if you want to.
You're an enabler, a contributer to this crap when you release them of responsibility for their bad deeds by saying it's society to blame. BS.
That's the gimme, poor me, victim me attitude that spawns irresponsible people.
April 10, 2008
3:38 p.m.
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Heidi writes:
davies, don't be silly. What do you think?
April 10, 2008
3:38 p.m.
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El_Braino writes:
American100,
How many times have you reached out to help a fellow man, woman, or child? Could you have done more? I know I could have. You are not at fault, you say, but you do send messages of hate on your blog, but you don't promote violence?
I hope you find inner peace, because you seem so rooted in your hate for all those who are not like you; or better yet, who are not like the person you believe to be.
April 10, 2008
3:38 p.m.
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GWM writes:
American loves to reach out to other men. Just listen.
April 10, 2008
3:41 p.m.
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davies writes:
"You want people who fail to reach out to other men to go to hell, but you are encouraging gang members to cut a baby in half? Where did you come from?"
This is the wisdom of Solomon, of course. Can't recall his ethnicity - can anyone help?
April 10, 2008
3:44 p.m.
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MeAgainstMachine writes:
El Braino - What are you trying to say here. This is quoted out of your post at 1:56p...
You've stated that you are raising kids. Hopefully they become as successful as you claim you are. But if your kids were to ever become news, they'd be lumped together with the rest of us unlawful, illegal Mexicans. Newspapers don't print ancestry documents...
Please explain the second to last sentence to us.
By the way I applaude American100, you are a true American...from another land, but a man of the flag.
April 10, 2008
3:47 p.m.